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#268208 - 12/21/08 02:06 PM Juvenile Offenders
Still Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 02/16/07
Posts: 6401
Loc: 2.5 NATO Nations
The quality is weak, but listen to this report!!!!
Its particularly disturbing to me given that my perps were all 12 years old when it began.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PDfcuw67V78&feature=related



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#268209 - 12/21/08 02:34 PM Re: Juvenile Offenders [Re: Still]
jacobtk Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 04/08/03
Posts: 527
I understand where you're coming from, but at the same time I think it's important to understand that a lot of people who offend, particularly child offenders, aren't necessarily going to re-offend, that they're treatable and most importantly that they're likely victims themselves. Prison really doesn't fix anybody and it's far less likely that a 12-year-old in prison for years will come out well-adjusted. In all likelihood a child that age will be preyed on by older inmates and the cycle will simply repeat itself.

The younger the offender, the less reasonable it seems to lock them up unless the act was particularly violent or the kid is uncontrollable. With older offenders like the boys mentioned in the report, chances are the reason they got such light sentences has more to do with those being their first offenses than attempts to let them walk.

I know it seems like they're getting away with it, but the greater importance is that they don't re-offend. If treatment will work, then that's really the best option.

_________________________
Every day I die again, and again Iím reborn/Every day I have to find the courage/To walk out into the street/With arms out/Got a love you canít defeat/Neither down nor out/Thereís nothing you have that I need/I can breathe/Breathe now - U2

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#268236 - 12/21/08 06:16 PM Re: Juvenile Offenders [Re: jacobtk]
Trucker51 Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 05/20/08
Posts: 2826
Loc: Denver, CO
And here in Boulder, CO last week several college-age streaker's got lucky that they were offered a plea-bargain which avoided them having to register as sex-offenders. I guess pissing behind a dumpster in the dark is now a sex-offense too, along with revealing a little too much skin at the beach or having a wardrobe malfunction too.

I too do not see what good that it does to classify teenage juvenile offenders as adult sexual offenders despite what the effect is on their victims. I really think that treatment and some kind of restitution for juvenile offenders would go a long way toward reducing the problem and lowering our incarceration and readjustment costs too.

I still think that all younger offenders and most first-time offenders should be segregated from the general prison population and treated for their transgressions. Otherwise our prison population will continue to grow to an unmanageable and unaffordable level. Right now we have 2 million people in prison in this country times a yearly cost of $30K or more each. $60 Billion yearly could be much better spent considering the lost productivity and lost consumer spending costs are in addition to that.

I know that it is tough being a victim too.

Mark

_________________________
"We stay here, we die here. We've got to keep moving". Trucker Mark



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#268244 - 12/21/08 07:45 PM Re: Juvenile Offenders [Re: jacobtk]
Still Offline
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MaleSurvivor

Registered: 02/16/07
Posts: 6401
Loc: 2.5 NATO Nations
Originally Posted By: jacobtk
I understand where you're coming from, but at the same time I think it's important to understand that a lot of people who offend, particularly child offenders, aren't necessarily going to re-offend, that they're treatable and most importantly that they're likely victims themselves. Prison really doesn't fix anybody and it's far less likely that a 12-year-old in prison for years will come out well-adjusted. In all likelihood a child that age will be preyed on by older inmates and the cycle will simply repeat itself.

The younger the offender, the less reasonable it seems to lock them up unless the act was particularly violent or the kid is uncontrollable. With older offenders like the boys mentioned in the report, chances are the reason they got such light sentences has more to do with those being their first offenses than attempts to let them walk.

I know it seems like they're getting away with it, but the greater importance is that they don't re-offend. If treatment will work, then that's really the best option.


Oh....I'm not claiming they cant be fixed. However, so few of them are ever caught. I know 4 who never were caught.

I honestly don't think they ought to do normal time either, but they ought not go unpunished and they ought not go without mandatory T, and they (and their parents) ought not go without dramatic (DRAMATIC and DEVASTATING) financial restitution to their victims and the victims families.

I fully believe that the civil renumeration ought to be SO fkg dramatic, the judge himself will faint from what he orders.

If you dont know why I demand such dramatic civil penalty, just ask. I'll tell.

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#268245 - 12/21/08 07:54 PM Re: Juvenile Offenders [Re: Still]
michael banks Offline


Registered: 06/12/08
Posts: 1755
Loc: Mojave Desert, Ca
Rob,

OK why.

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To own one's shadow is the highest moral act of a human.
-Robert Johnson-

"IT ought never be forgotten that the past is the parent of the future" John C. Calhoun

WOR Alumni Sequoia 2009

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#268250 - 12/21/08 09:13 PM Re: Juvenile Offenders [Re: Still]
jacobtk Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 04/08/03
Posts: 527
Originally Posted By: Robbie Brown
I fully believe that the civil renumeration ought to be SO fkg dramatic, the judge himself will faint from what he orders.

If you dont know why I demand such dramatic civil penalty, just ask. I'll tell.


I really would like to know why, however, I can already say I don't think that's a good idea.

_________________________
Every day I die again, and again Iím reborn/Every day I have to find the courage/To walk out into the street/With arms out/Got a love you canít defeat/Neither down nor out/Thereís nothing you have that I need/I can breathe/Breathe now - U2

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#268330 - 12/22/08 07:45 PM Re: Juvenile Offenders [Re: jacobtk]
Still Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 02/16/07
Posts: 6401
Loc: 2.5 NATO Nations
How many guys here have had their lives ruined to the point that they cannot earn a decent living? There are guys here who are extremely bright and qualified for higher-level jobs and income but have to deal with all the debilitating barriers installed by the perps.

Everything about my life's development was pushed back a full decade. By the time I finally brushed myself off and sought a new life I was 26 years old, had drug and alcohol issues and no education.

Now, in any civil jurisdiction, the parents, guardians or determinable other supervisory adults are responsible for the actions of the minors in their control.

Given that the victim's life is likely ruined beyond quantification, heavy (FKG HEAVY) civil penalty ought to be full enough to support the victim for the rest of his natural life.

Look at some recent civil SETTLEMENTS for hard and soft-tissue injuries:

Brain Damage: $12M of an ADULT (42 yrs old)
Shattered Knee: $5M for a 30 yo male
Inhalation of toxic fumes: $22M for an adult male with resperatory damage.

The exemplary settlements and judicial or jury awards are quite clear. Intentional (or negligent) injury of another will cost you dearly.

If the parents of the little devils dont have enough insurance, they should be forced to liquidate any and all assets and have their wages and future gains captured for the benefit of the Sexual Assault victim.

If I were the judge, I'd make the award so painful that their ancestors will writhe in agony.

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The Water Buffalo Song

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#268392 - 12/23/08 02:51 AM Re: Juvenile Offenders [Re: Still]
jacobtk Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 04/08/03
Posts: 527
As I said before, I really don't think that's a good idea.

_________________________
Every day I die again, and again Iím reborn/Every day I have to find the courage/To walk out into the street/With arms out/Got a love you canít defeat/Neither down nor out/Thereís nothing you have that I need/I can breathe/Breathe now - U2

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#268463 - 12/23/08 04:30 PM Re: Juvenile Offenders [Re: Still]
pufferfish Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 02/26/08
Posts: 6852
Loc: USA
Originally Posted By: Robbie Brown
The quality is weak, but listen to this report!!!!
Its particularly disturbing to me given that my perps were all 12 years old when it began.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PDfcuw67V78&feature=related



I too was abused by 12-year-old boys. I was 6. My story is found in: (triggering)

http://www.malesurvivor.org/board/ubbthr...6048#Post216048

They were not instigated at all by adults. Their fathers were most likely away as part of the military effort, as was my father. I have no idea where they are today. The abuse took place in Fort Lupton CO. I had been abused previously and it probably made me an easier target. We were all lonely and had a "father hunger". The boys called us their "girls" which was quite upsetting to me. Even if they were possibly not pathologically oriented, they were being habituated by their behavior.

The legal system at that time would have been totally abashed in any attempt to deal with it. The legal system would still be unable to deal with it.

After my family moved to Denver, there were predator boys in my parent's social circle. One boy in particular, DS, was active in abusing me. He abused me 1 - 2 times a year for several years. For him it was a power trip, I believe. He was developing a predatory personality. He would have had to be dealt with more sternly by the legal system, assuming that was a possibility.

When I was 10, a 17-year-old across the street abused me. To me he seemed ancient. We now would say that he was an older teen. He groomed me and my friend briefly. He had probably been taught this behavior by his older brothers. I believe went on to be a perp and may have spent some time in the pen. My little friend learned how to do it and spent time in the pen. It was learned behavior.

triggering:

http://www.malesurvivor.org/board/ubbthr...8205#Post218205


Allen

pufferfish whistle


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#268471 - 12/23/08 05:23 PM Re: Juvenile Offenders [Re: jacobtk]
Still Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 02/16/07
Posts: 6401
Loc: 2.5 NATO Nations
Originally Posted By: jacobtk
As I said before, I really don't think that's a good idea.


Care you elaborate at all as to why?

[added evidence from MY situation]

21 years of substance abuse
11 jobs in 16 years
Thousands spent for Doctors
Getting divorced
Now out of my six-figure-income job
Paying $1100/month for health insurance
I will forever be fkd in the head from it all
Been hospitalized twice for suicidal behavior
Cant function in societal modes
Had several failed attempts at higher education

Please do elaborate why one ought not sue the juvenile offender and his family till their grand-children's teeth bleed?


BTW: In my town, a 12 yo boy was masturbating on the school bus and was cheered-on by others. He flung the output at the girl sitting in front of him. His parents are being sued into the next century for the trauma inflicted on her.

SHe cant go to the school again. She's afraid of going out and seeing anyone...sound familiar? She needs therapy and a private school.

Why should her parents pay that bill?

Fortunately, the courts in this country will suck the blood out of these parents till they dry-up and blow-away like dust. LOL..cool!

Fortunately, the courts don't give a flying fk what anyone other than a jury thinks! YAY!!!!

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