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#245800 - 08/20/08 12:27 PM Was it a LIE or a TRY?
Still Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 02/16/07
Posts: 6420
Loc: 2.5 NATO Nations
Spouses and Significant-others,

I did not disclose until 15 years into my marriage and was confronted numerous times with claims that "I had to have been sexually abused as a kid to have the issues I have." I always denied, denied, denied! The end result is/was a lot of pain for my wife and the eventual destruction of our marriage.

I'm going to draw upon Muldoon's prior post to explain my position on this now AND back then:
______________________________


I know that many of you feel that we where dishonest by not telling you about the abuse before we got married. Most of us didn't think there was anything important to tell. Shit the SA had no effect on our live so far and it wasn't going to effect our lives together with you. What was there to tell?

We have been told all our lives to

Just Get Over IT - MOVE ON - PUT IT BEHIND YOU

Little did we know how it was all going to come back and rip our lives apart years later.

_______________________


So my question is....did I lie? Did I not lie? Am I evil and manipulative? Am I self-centered? WAS I self-centered? Is all of this an all-around Casualty-Cluster?

_________________________
This nation has lost its mind!

The Aftermath Video

The Water Buffalo Song

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#245805 - 08/20/08 12:44 PM Re: Was it a LIE or a TRY? [Re: Still]
JustScott Offline
Greeter Emeritus
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 01/27/08
Posts: 2577
For me, I didn't remember most of my abuse, and the little things I did remember were recognized or understood for what they were. When I did realize.... wow did that brick wall come out of nowhere.

My wife at least has understood me in that, that I didn't remember. Although she has said that she wishes I would have dealt with it all before we got married. Although she also recognizes that you can't make a person deal with something they're not ready to deal with.

I don't think you lied. Some would say that not telling is the same as lying, but I don't think it is. Especially, when as you say, it didn't seem like it was a big deal, it was in the past and all that.

No, I have never seen you as evil or manipulative. I see you trying to deal with your issues so you can better be there for the people in your life. I'm sorry you're wife isn't sticking around for that day to come. I take joy in the fact that my wife is. She's trying hard. I hate how much all this hurts her.

Casualty Cluster.... Yeah I think it is in some ways. Our abusers hit us and now our families are getting hit because of it. Like WWII mines that people still find the hard way after all this time....

I know I'm not a spouse or SO in the sense that you meant in your post, but I figured I'd from my experience thus far. Maybe they'll all disagree, I don't know. I typically avoid the F&F forums because the few times I haven't I've found myself nosediving right into the ground.

Hang in there Rob!


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#245831 - 08/20/08 01:29 PM Re: Was it a LIE or a TRY? [Re: JustScott]
Trish4850 Offline
BoD Liaison Emeritus
MaleSurvivor<

Registered: 10/15/05
Posts: 3280
Loc: New Jersey
Quote:
So my question is....did I lie? Did I not lie?


If you had memories of the abuse, then yes, you lied, especially if you were confronted with the direct questions.

Quote:
Am I evil and manipulative?


No. Whether the fears were real or imagined, the lie was to protect yourself as well as Lorie.

Quote:
Am I self-centered? WAS I self-centered?


I don't know, are you? I don't see that at all here. I see a man who cares about others. I see a guy who is going through a horrible time himself who still shows up here and lends support. I see a guy who vents frustration and anger but takes to heart the advice of people who are trying to help. I see a guy who saved a turtle and gave it to his kids. That doesn't sound self centered to me.

Quote:
Is all of this an all-around Casualty-Cluster?


Yes it is. The casualties of csa don't stop because the csa does. Everyone you get close to suffers for it in one way or another.

My b/f told me relatively early on about his abusive childhood, leaving out the sexual abuse part of it. It was 4 years into our relationship before I found out about that. If I really think on it, I probably did feel lied to because I didn't know the whole truth, but I didn't feel hurt for long because of that lie. I learned pretty darn quickly what was behind that particular issue and it made perfect sense to me why he wouldn't tell me. That issue has been put away never to be thought of again because it is a non-issue. There were things in the recent past that needed to be addresses at the time and there are alot of things going forward that we/he needs to deal with that are so much more important than when I found out.

ROCK ON..........Trish

_________________________
If you fall down 10 times, Stand up 11.

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#245848 - 08/20/08 02:00 PM Re: Was it a LIE or a TRY? [Re: Still]
pufferfish Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 02/26/08
Posts: 6866
Loc: USA
Originally Posted By: Robbie Brown

I did not disclose until 15 years into my marriage and was confronted numerous times with claims that "I had to have been sexually abused as a kid to have the issues I have." I always denied, denied, denied! The end result is/was a lot of pain for my wife and the eventual destruction of our marriage.
Little did we know how it was all going to come back and rip our lives apart years later.


So my question is....did I lie? Did I not lie? Am I evil and manipulative? Am I self-centered? WAS I self-centered? Is all of this an all-around Casualty-Cluster?


Denial is denial. It is not lying but avoiding an issue that is too big to handle at the time. We buy time in which to deal with an issue so horrendous that it would be destructive to face it immediately.

The dictionery says of denial: Psychology. An unconscious defense mechanism characterized by refusal to acknowledge painful realities, thoughts, or feelings

Yes, it does affect others; wives and children and others. But hopefully they will be able to grow with us when we face the issue later.

Robbie, you have grown a lot just in the few months I have been on this MS site. You can't beat yourself up for not being mature at the beginning of your journey.

Allen

Puffer



Edited by pufferfish (08/20/08 02:15 PM)

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#245849 - 08/20/08 02:05 PM Re: Was it a LIE or a TRY? [Re: Trish4850]
Junefriday Offline


Registered: 06/05/08
Posts: 113
Loc: Canada
I remember a quote once where a person was asked if she lies. She answered, "I don't have to." The reality is that sometimes people lie because they have to. It doesn't make them a bad person, it just means that there is something preventing them from telling the truth. Sometimes they don't know what the truth is, sometimes they think they are telling the truth, sometimes they lie to spare someone's feelings, and sometimes people lie knowingly and without regard for its impacts.

I don't really know if you lied. I am not entirely sure that it matters. I think what is more important is the context around why you didn't disclose earlier and how you feel about the impact of the "omission".

My H didn't tell me about his CSA. He didn't think he needed to. He didn't think it was still affecting him. It sure would have made things a lot clearer if he had. But I wouldn't say that things would have been easier. If he had told me before we got married, maybe I wouldn't have married him. I don't know. If I hadn't married him, maybe I wouldn't be in the hell I am in now. But then again, I wouldn't have had the brief time of complete heaven with him that I did. I don't know. I don't have any of the answers.

All I do know is that these are the cards we've been dealt. How we play them going forward is up to us. That is what matters. You can't undo the past but you can focus on the future. If my H came to me now and said that he can't undo the fact that he didn't tell me before but wants to focus on moving forward, I could forget about his "omission" in a heartbeat. A future with him is what I care about. I know the past has an impact and knowing what the past involves allows us to move forward knowing that we have some work to do. I wouldn't say that my husband that my husband lied because I don't think that was his intent. I got hurt but I know that he never meant for that to happen.

_________________________
"Love comes to those who still hope even though they've been disappointed, to those who still believe even though they've been betrayed, to those who still love even though they've been hurt before.

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#245888 - 08/20/08 05:55 PM Re: Was it a LIE or a TRY? [Re: Junefriday]
mogigo Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 04/24/07
Posts: 1331
Loc: Colorado
Quote:
I remember a quote once where a person was asked if she lies. She answered, "I don't have to." The reality is that sometimes people lie because they have to. It doesn't make them a bad person, it just means that there is something preventing them from telling the truth. Sometimes they don't know what the truth is, sometimes they think they are telling the truth, sometimes they lie to spare someone's feelings, and sometimes people lie knowingly and without regard for its impacts.


I think this is the exact thought of why you didn't lie Rob. When you didn't tell, did you know the outcome, did you think it would affect you're future with you're wife. I'm sure you can answer "no" to this question, but the question you were answering was "Will this affect my future with you" in you're mind at the time it was a big fat "no". The question posed wasn't "was I abused as a child" it was "is this going to have an effect on my future with you". You believed that "no it wasn't", at the time Rob.

Give yourself some slack my friend

I think the end question is "did I hurt my wife on purpose", I think you know the answer to that Rob .

Collateral damage suck's but it is part of war. Second guessing it help's no one, including those hit by the shraptnel.

Back to the war Rob, we're winning. That battle sucked but concentrate on the "peace treaty", you're wife will sign it too because that's what's best for everyone in the end.

Stay strong
Mike

_________________________
Thriving

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#245990 - 08/21/08 10:46 AM Re: Was it a LIE or a TRY? [Re: mogigo]
indygal Offline
Member

Registered: 06/22/06
Posts: 439
Rob,

I think you already know the answers to all your questions; just that you either doubt your own resolve or are wondering why the answers aren't always the same - that is - in some situations, perhaps you did lie - when in others, you honestly didn't realize what the heck was going on.

Your wife, your best friends, your family, (least of all people on this site) none of those people can tell you exactly how and what you were feeling, thinking or doing in the past (or now either for that matter). Only you can answer these questions and only you can find the resolution that will be satisfactory for - you.

You will find it, I promise. You are well on the way; it may still take some time, but it will come. Be strong, be brave and most of all, be patient with yourself.

Then, whatever you discover, accept it as what it is, nothing more and nothing less. It is you, love yourself for that reason alone.

After that, then you can try and pick up the pieces, celebrate the goodness and live for the future, instead of the past.

All the best,
Indy

_________________________
my avatar is one of the Battle Angel characters, fighting the good fight.

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#246060 - 08/21/08 06:44 PM Re: Was it a LIE or a TRY? [Re: indygal]
dgoods Offline
Guest

Registered: 10/15/07
Posts: 622
Loc: Richmond area
Indy,
always good to read your posts. Not that this alters what you've set forth, but speaking for myself, one of the hardest knots to attempt to untangle is "Since i've come to realize just how insidious the effects of CSA can be, how much of "me" is me, and how much of my thinking/decision-making has been/is colored by what happened to me?"

Sometimes i'm reminded of that old Tootsie-Pop commercial; "The world may never know..."

_________________________
Give sorrow words: the grief that does not speak
Whispers the o'er-fraught heart and bids it break.

-William Shakespeare, Macbeth, Act IV, Sc. III

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#246155 - 08/22/08 02:48 AM Re: Was it a LIE or a TRY? [Re: dgoods]
NY Daisy Offline
New Here

Registered: 02/29/08
Posts: 183
Dear Robbie,

I've read many of your posts and know you feel that disclosure was a huge mistake. I can see where you are coming from. This is my opinion on your situation.

Did you lie? Probably. Or did you? You have to remember that this was something you had drilled in your head for many years that it was something to never be shared,it was a secret that you were supposed to take to your grave. Your perp did his best to make sure you complied with that. So when asked flat out if you had been abused, you said no. It was your instinctual response. Like so many other things, I look at this answer as a learned behavior.

I do not think that you set out to deceive your wife at all. I do think that you feel horrible for causing her pain, you disclosed when it was right for Robbie, and for whatever reasons you had. Even though it does not feel like disclosure was the right decision now, I hope someday that you will see that it was.

I know you feel like you have lost so much in the process, and it must be so hard for you right now, but maybe you can look at it this way, what do you have to gain from this? Only you can really answer that question, but I'm thinking ROBBIE.

I think you asked this question because you are filled with guilt. you are taking sole responsibility for everything that went wrong in your marriage. You need to cut yourself some slack.

You are a good person, you help many people here. Things will get better for you, and someday you will meet someone, and you will know it was all worth it.

Warmly, NYDAISY


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#246420 - 08/24/08 07:05 PM Re: Was it a LIE or a TRY? [Re: NY Daisy]
sugarbaby Offline


Registered: 08/17/08
Posts: 341
Robbie - I am completely new to this issue but I've read several of your posts (printed one out for my husband to read) and you and him are very much alike. In my opinion, it was a TRY.

My husband didn't say anything for 34 years - 15.5 years into our relationship he told me. He tried, it just didn't work.


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