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#239873 - 07/23/08 08:16 PM Re: Other People don't "GET IT" [Re: LittleMiss]
indygal Offline
Member

Registered: 06/22/06
Posts: 439
LittleMiss,

I DO understand and respect your marriage vows - I've done them in the past and yes, did everything I could to keep them but alas, that marriage was doomed from the beginning - still I understand your wanting to keep his privacy.

Still, there is a point - when it's YOUR life, NOT his that you must think of; you already said it - it's your family, your friends, that are so concerned.

Sometimes when you don't say the "why" is when people do say someone just needs to "get over it" simply because you aren't putting the real deal out there for them to know otherwise. or it's cause they're idiots also!

you are going thru a transition phase now that hurts a lot - it's the reversion back to being a single person - slowly you'll realize that you do need to make decisions based on what's good for you and not necessarily for him - just as it's time for him to make his own decisions about his life and obviously, he's making them based on what's good for him, not necessarily for you - kind of hurts, huh?

believe me, you are not "pushing it on him" by sharing what's going on in your life with your marriage - as I said, you own your recovery also. the more you hold in, the longer it will take to stand up again, walk straight and go forward. The longer you hold it in, the longer it will hurt.

no one can tell you when it's time to let go of the hurt, only you can do that. I'm sorry, so very sorry you have to go thru this. When I first came on this site 2 years ago I never imagined now I'd be sharing this way - it's all so very surreal - sigh...

remember also - years ago it was the silence that protected the abuser and created the victim that was your husband. I'm a strong believer in breaking that silence - to me maintaining the silence as an adult without question is not much different than those who possibly could have done something when he was a child.

that is, if you knew a child was being abused, would'nt you speak up?? would you say I must protect the child's secret? of course not!! would you protect the abuser's secret?? of course not!!

it's not all that different tho of course adult survivors will rant and scream and throw all kinds of tantrums that it's their right to tell, etc etc even as they suffer in silence alone, scared and withdrawn.

breaking the silence is important for all of us; we can do it with tact, and as much educational information as possible, it doesn't have to be done in a thoughtless manner; done with love and care it can help a lot of people.

all the best,
Indy

_________________________
my avatar is one of the Battle Angel characters, fighting the good fight.

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#239875 - 07/23/08 08:23 PM Re: Other People don't "GET IT" [Re: indygal]
CDavid Offline


Registered: 07/05/08
Posts: 184
"...would you protect the abuser's secret?? of course not!!

it's not all that different tho of course adult survivors will rant and scream and throw all kinds of tantrums that it's their right to tell, etc etc even as they suffer in silence alone, scared and withdrawn."

There's an interesting tact.

Be afraid, be very afraid.


CD


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#239885 - 07/23/08 08:57 PM Re: Other People don't "GET IT" [Re: CDavid]
Trish4850 Offline
BoD Liaison Emeritus
MaleSurvivor<

Registered: 10/15/05
Posts: 3280
Loc: New Jersey
Little Miss,

I hope you decide to see a T yourself. I did for a while and would not hesitate to go back. The T I saw was also experienced in csa and while she was MY sounding board and my advocate, she knew exactly what my b/f was going through too. It was so nice to have someone in real life who knew I wasn't a crazy person for electing to stay with a man with so many troubles in life.

I understand why you don't want to speak with other people about the underlying issue. I won't either. It's not my story to tell. The most anyone has gotten out of me, if they're close, is that he had a horrible childhood that's had some long lasting effects. Several times, that statement has been met with follow questions, but I just leave it at "I don't feel comfortable going into detail because it's not my story to tell." That usually closes the conversation, at least in that direction.

I do occasionally talk to family and friends about "today" problems because that's my release and I feel I am entitled to it. My b/f understands that as well. But I, like you, will not betray the trust he placed in me. If he ever chooses to tell his story, I'll stand by him tall and proud, but I won't be the one to "out" him.

ROCK ON.......Trish



_________________________
If you fall down 10 times, Stand up 11.

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#239944 - 07/24/08 07:06 AM Re: Other People don't "GET IT" [Re: Trish4850]
indygal Offline
Member

Registered: 06/22/06
Posts: 439
and let me all ask you a question you perhaps have never thought of -

all the while it's quite obvious you are so ready to condemn someone who's heart is in the right place, thinking there is more here than just your own situations - there is that of those who are being abused right now, as I type this, the untold number of victims, right now, and who will continue being abused, right now, until enough people come forward and say, as one, as a society, enough is enough.

so, which is better - you are able to have a thoughtful, intelligent discussion about however much you choose to share with someone you consider a friend or close family member -

or you let them go ahead and live in ignorance of your pain and your partner's pain and quite possibly, leave the world as it is without their possible input, or energy, or of course, as I stated previously, perhaps holding off on their own recovery because no one they've ever known has spoken about these things before so of course the difficulties they are having in their own lives could not possibly have anything to do with csa, now could it?

discussing what effects you is your right - it's not "outing" someone - discussing how someone has treated you in a way that others don't think is right and they want to know why you bother to continue loving that person - there is absolutely nothing wrong with explaining the situation with as much care and thoughtfulness that you can possibly muster.

I find it deeply offensive when some of you dare to jump on this as if someone is doing something wrong - there is nothing wrong with talking about csa - it is a terrible crime; it is a crime against humanity even - and until people can own up to it happening and put away the shame, it's going to continue for generations to come.

Indy

_________________________
my avatar is one of the Battle Angel characters, fighting the good fight.

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#239947 - 07/24/08 07:17 AM Re: Other People don't "GET IT" [Re: indygal]
BJK Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 08/02/07
Posts: 1526
It's not CSA in particular that I'm talking about here. It's pain. Pain is a deeply personal matter, and I find it to be absolutely imperative to ensure that more pain isn't compiled before I disclose that pain to someone else.

It's not an act of condemnation when I decide to not share my pain with another person. It is an act of self preservation along with an act of respecting another person's boundaries.

And, no...this has nothing to do with shame, and it has nothing to do with protecting children.

Bryan

_________________________
Revenge is nothing more than another way of perpetuating abuse.

What the world needs now
Is some new words of wisdom
Like la la la la la la la la la.
-David Lowery

Having a friend who will keep a secret for you is worthless compared to a friend who won't keep a secret from you.

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#239948 - 07/24/08 07:19 AM Re: Other People don't "GET IT" [Re: indygal]
CDavid Offline


Registered: 07/05/08
Posts: 184
Recovery is about reclaiming what was taken, Indy. It wasn't lost, we did not misplace it...it was taken.

No one, absolutely no one has the right to share another's story, regardless of how altruistic the motives are, without their permision.

CD


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#239952 - 07/24/08 07:24 AM Re: Other People don't "GET IT" [Re: CDavid]
BJK Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 08/02/07
Posts: 1526
Originally Posted By: CDavid
Recovery is about reclaiming what was taken, Indy. It wasn't lost, we did not misplace it...it was taken.

No one, absolutely no one has the right to share another's story, regardless of how altruistic the motives are, without their permision.

CD


My father shared my story before I was ready to go "completely public" with it. He shared it with his one close, personal friend who also happens to be friends with my mother, the perp. I was very hurt by this. However, I have come to realize that the topic of sexual abuse was so completely foreign to him, I seriously don't think he could have coped with it by keeping it inside.

At least he had the balls to come forward and admit that he had to disclose to someone. I'll forever respect him for that.

But at the same time, I seriously wish he had been more careful, for the situation ended up turning worse for a while as a result.

Bryan

_________________________
Revenge is nothing more than another way of perpetuating abuse.

What the world needs now
Is some new words of wisdom
Like la la la la la la la la la.
-David Lowery

Having a friend who will keep a secret for you is worthless compared to a friend who won't keep a secret from you.

Top
#239967 - 07/24/08 09:30 AM Re: Other People don't "GET IT" [Re: BJK]
indygal Offline
Member

Registered: 06/22/06
Posts: 439
Originally Posted By: BJK
Having a friend who will keep a secret for you is worthless compared to a friend who won't keep a secret from you.


BJK, you know, I keep wondering why you have this under your comments.

is it just sometimes a person should not keep a secret?

tell me please, who is to say what qualifies as a secret and what doesn't?

and also - to others - who is supposed to say who can talk about csa and who can't?

you all seem to think you are the end all of the subject at hand - you aren't - not at all - there's more here than just you all to be considered - there are others; many others and there will continue to be others until society changes it's perception as to what is and is not acceptable to do to children.

you know, I'm reminded of a film - "In and Out" starring Kevin Kline. maybe you've seen it - it's a comedy of sorts. this guy is engaged to a woman, they live in a somewhat smallish town, one high school. He's a teacher there. People accuse him of being gay and he even wonders himself.

Finally, he realizes, he IS gay and comes out to the town and breaks off the marriage. The school wants him to quit and tells him he can't come to the graduation ceremony.

At the ceremony, he shows up and there's an exchange of words. Next thing, people start standing up and saying they are gay - pretty soon, everyone in the auditorium, even his parents, say they are gay too.

The point was to bring it out in the open, expose it for what it was - something personal, yes, but also something that was irrelevant to this man being a teacher, and a well-respected one at that.

At first when the school tried to fire the teacher for being gay, there was hurt and shame, and yes, lots and lots of pain. But after so many people stood beside him and said they were gay too, even when they weren't, the pain turned into joy as he realized people loved him and supported him, no matter who or what his sexual preference was.

Being identified as a csa survivor can only do the kind of damage people let it do as long as it remains a stigma; and it will remain a stigma as long as people shut it out of conversation, don't talk about it, hide it, and "protect" those who are known to be survivors for "fear" of - well - I'm not sure exactly.

one of the reasons this site is so successful is because people found it impossible to hold this in - they needed somewhere to go to talk about their issues and questions - and learned they weren't alone - this website is a kind of interim step until the public, in general, can learn to accept and understand more about what csa does to children and how it effects not just the child but the child that grows into an adult and in turn, relationships, and society in general.

I do understand many of you don't care about that right now and it's only your own peace of mind and safety that matter to you - and it should be - but some day - hopefully - you will understand how important it is to speak up about csa and to do so without fear.

all the best,
Indy

_________________________
my avatar is one of the Battle Angel characters, fighting the good fight.

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#239975 - 07/24/08 10:34 AM Re: Other People don't "GET IT" [Re: indygal]
BJK Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 08/02/07
Posts: 1526
Indy,

You are absolutely correct when you say that secrets should not be kept. What also must be considered is that secrets become easier to disclose the more we disclose them. However, we cannot just expect someone to break the secret to the whole world all at once. It's a process. In order to keep my sanity, I needed some kind of control over how quickly the news spread. I'm at the point in my recovery right now where I'd like the whole world to know. It's not a secret anymore, and a tremendous weight has been lifted from my chest. However, I've also come to the realization that some people simply don't want to know.

The friends I have who have been friends for a long time, even the ones I shared addictions with, all now know that I had a terrible childhood and am now choosing to face it. If they wish to pursue that further and ask questions, I will answer them openly and honestly. A year ago, when this first started coming out, I would not have been able to handle those questions. It took me a very difficult year to get to this point. With most survivors, it takes much, much longer.

I think that partners of survivors have to take that into consideration. Your loved one might not be able to handle an inappropriate question about his past, and if you disclose to someone, you run the risk of such a question coming up. Furthermore, if you choose to disclose your loved one's past to someone else, you'd better be prepared to let your loved one know about that disclosure, for keeping that disclosure to yourself is another example of keeping a secret.

Bryan

_________________________
Revenge is nothing more than another way of perpetuating abuse.

What the world needs now
Is some new words of wisdom
Like la la la la la la la la la.
-David Lowery

Having a friend who will keep a secret for you is worthless compared to a friend who won't keep a secret from you.

Top
#240018 - 07/24/08 05:40 PM Re: Other People don't "GET IT" [Re: BJK]
LittleMiss Offline


Registered: 07/02/08
Posts: 66
Loc: USA
Trish - I say that too - "He had a bad childhood. He's not close to his family."


INDY - I understand what you are saying, and I want you to understand that in NO way am I mad/upset/annoyed/or anything by your views. Tone is hard to convey sometimes in writing, so I wanted to make that clear. (Capitalization is only meant for emphasis - not yelling) :-) I respect you opinions and I am glad that they worked in your situation.

That said, I still stand by my decision to NOT tell anyone the WHY of my relationship crisis. I still say that my husband trusted me with that information and unless HE says it is ok to share, then I CANNOT share. His trust would be shattered (again) and maybe he would be long going before he trusted again.

I understand what you are saying about changing viewpoints, changing the world, how this is not a stigma.

BUT - my husband works in a VERY male dominated working world. It is not the environment of "enlightened, understanding, open" people. Individually, yes, of course some of them are - but as a group, H**L NO.

At this moment, I am not out to change the world. Only help my husband. And I certainly don't think making him the figure head of some crusade is the way to do it. I WISH the world was a place were he could be open - but he feels that life has proved to him that it is not. If I betray his trust, I only further prove that.

You said that we wouldn't keep the secret if we knew a child at this moment was being victemized. No, we would not - we would stop the abuse ---- BUT we would not walk into the child's classroom and share with his 'friends' the details of what has happened to him either, would we? Sometimes sharing does just as much damage. - that is what I am trying to prevent.

(Also - as bad as this all is, I am not ready to think of myself as single yet. In my mind, we are still a team.)

_________________________
LittleMiss

The woods are lovely, dark and deep. But I have promises to keep,
And miles to go before I sleep, And miles to go before I sleep.

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