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#232562 - 06/22/08 01:17 PM Re: Masturbation and [the bible, ie, religion] [Re: Still]
Sans Logos Offline
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robbie, i do appreciate your perspective, but i think you misinterpreted my statement as implying something that was not intended.

today's culture obviously interprets>
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#232840 - 06/23/08 08:33 PM Re: Masturbation and [the bible, ie, religion] [Re: Sans Logos]
pufferfish Offline
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Registered: 02/26/08
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Wow! This subject has really attracted a lot of attention!

As a very small boy (4 years) I had begun masturbating after being abused. My mother threatened to cut off my pecker if I persisted. I took her seriously and stopped. Then for years I had a fear of it and didn't practice it. I think my hormone levels were low enough during those years that it was fairly easy to resist.

But then at age of 14, two friends were talking about a school classmate who had been fondled by his scout leader. It led to a desire to experiment. We all rode our bikes home separately and experimented in our separate bath tubs. This time it was successful. It led to a daily habit over the years. Because of my earlier experience I had a lot of guilt about it. I went to the library and checked out several books on sex. None of these said that a boy should feel guilty about masturbation.

Many guys are troubled about the following verses from the Bible:

8 Then Judah said to Onan, "Lie with your brother's wife and fulfill your duty to her as a brother-in-law to produce offspring for your brother." 9 But Onan knew that the offspring would not be his; so whenever he lay with his brother's wife, he spilled his semen on the ground to keep from producing offspring for his brother. 10 What he did was wicked in the Lord's sight; so he put him to death also.
Genesis 38:8-10 (NIV)

But if you read this carefully it does not say he masturbated at all. What Onan did here was coitus interruptus. Onan was having sex with his dead brother's wife and withdrew before ejaculation. So this passage is not even talking about masturbation. That is what the passage clearly says.

Puffer


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#233185 - 06/24/08 06:25 PM Re: Masturbation and [the bible, ie, religion] [Re: pufferfish]
FormerTexan Offline
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Puffer,

I have heard so often how this verse is used to guilt-burden boys over this. That is nothing short of spiritual abuse. But it goes back to my original question. What if a man cannot marry, for whatever reason? Is he supposed to just "burn with passion," as Paul puts it? I personally do not believe so.

Andy

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#233272 - 06/24/08 09:20 PM Re: Masturbation and [the bible, ie, religion] [Re: FormerTexan]
pufferfish Offline
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Originally Posted By: FormerTexan
Puffer,

What if a man cannot marry, for whatever reason? Is he supposed to just "burn with passion," as Paul puts it? I personally do not believe so.

Andy


Did I say this?

We probably agree. I know there are some in leadership positions who are able to "abstain" and they think that every guy should follow suit. I think that it is really what is in our thoughts when we do it that determines whether it is right or not.

I don't think the word "burn" in this verse is referring to an eternal state. It is talking about an intensity of feeling.

Puffer


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#233299 - 06/24/08 10:14 PM Re: Masturbation and [the bible, ie, religion] [Re: pufferfish]
FormerTexan Offline
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Puffer,

No you did not say this. I was simply rehashing my original question. The word "burn" in this verse does not refer to the eternal sense, which has to do with an eternal punishment. The word burn here, to me, represents a sexual drive. I would have to look up the greek to get exact meanings.

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#233326 - 06/24/08 11:06 PM Re: Masturbation and [the bible, ie, religion] [Re: FormerTexan]
roadrunner Offline
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Originally Posted By: FormerTexan
I would have to look up the greek to get exact meanings.

The Greek is πυρόομαι, which in late ancient colloquial Greek, the language of the NT, means "to burn up". In the passage in Corinthians it's used figuratively, i.e. "to burn up with [some emotion]", such as anger, desire, curiosity, etc. Here the verb is present passive infinitive, so the meaning is "to be burned up with [some emotion]". In the context that emotion clearly must be sexual desire. Yay! Professor Keaney would be proud of me. \:D

Much love,
Larry

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#233350 - 06/25/08 12:10 AM Re: Masturbation and [the bible, ie, religion] [Re: roadrunner]
FormerTexan Offline
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Thank you Larry. \:\)

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#233379 - 06/25/08 01:20 AM Re: Masturbation and [the bible, ie, religion] [Re: FormerTexan]
roadrunner Offline
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Registered: 05/02/05
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Andy,

The prefix of the Greek verb is pyro, which of course we still use to refer to burning: pyromaniac, pyrotechnics, etc. And in European languages the influence of the idiom still survives: "burning with curiosity", "that burns me up", etc.

Who woulda thunk it? Old-fashioned philology relevant on MaleSurvivor? What's next? \:D

Much joyous word-crunching,
Larry

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As I go walking my freedom highway.
Nobody living can make me turn back:
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#233669 - 06/26/08 05:53 AM Re: Masturbation and [the bible, ie, religion] [Re: roadrunner]
blueshift Offline
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Registered: 01/21/08
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I was spiritually abused to use formertexan's term which I think is a good one. I heard that my body was a temple of God and that to masturbate was to defile the temple of God.
At some point though I said "God, your temple has an erection and it isn't a steeple." lol

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#233702 - 06/26/08 08:04 AM Re: Masturbation and [the bible, ie, religion] [Re: blueshift]
Sans Logos Offline
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frikkin hilarious. i love this forum. it's probably the only place on the cyber planet where god is allowed to laugh out loud.

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