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#224439 - 05/15/08 06:10 PM ulp
ineffable Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 02/07/08
Posts: 1371
Loc: state of holeecrapdood
Brian recently challenged me to personalize a thread

So here goes "nothing"

I am a huge avoider (my middle initial is A & it stands for avoidance among other things)
Even when it came to this
Because it had or has to do with me
I will go out of my way for someone else I care about as long as little or ideally nothing about me is involved
My observations? Sure! My knowledge? Don't mind if I do...
What's going on "with" me?
eeesh
Someone here asked a series a questions months ago & I have avoided answering them
I also promised him a long email to catch him up
Nothing
I am avoiding facing myself by not* putting me down in words & the reality that is my life (or lack thereof)
I have next to no self trust
Because I continually let myself & others down
I neglect to follow through
I procrastinate
Doing things for myself I feel nothing
So why bother

God personalizing sucks

C

* edited to add "not" whoa talk about freudian slips without it



Edited by ineffable (05/15/08 06:24 PM)
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:: "Anyone who can handle a needle convincingly can make us see a thread which is not there" ::


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#224465 - 05/15/08 09:47 PM Re: ulp [Re: ineffable]
mogigo Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 04/24/07
Posts: 1331
Loc: Colorado
Maybe what that someone really really needed was you to answer those questions so it would be really really helpful for him with his stuff to have those questions answered

Wouldn't want to miss a chance to help yourself, I mean someone, would you Craig

Mike

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#224471 - 05/15/08 10:18 PM Re: ulp [Re: mogigo]
ineffable Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 02/07/08
Posts: 1371
Loc: state of holeecrapdood
Hey Mike

I get what you are saying
Ironically they were all very "surface" questions like 5 things you hate, etc &
there were a lot all at once
I felt almost like I was being interrogated
I also like to think about things when I can before responding
(trying to be less reactive)
If I felt answering would have helped someone/myself in my recovery I would have answered
them all swiftly & the best I could
In this case, maybe building trust?

I have difficulty with casual conversation (as a few here have experienced)
As well, I honestly was ashamed when I thought how my answers would compare to the asker's experience
Comparison sucks almost as much as personalization

Mike, if at anytime, I deflected anything you have asked me about, please forgive me
I am trying to be more revealing in a personal way

C




_________________________
:: "Anyone who can handle a needle convincingly can make us see a thread which is not there" ::


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#224484 - 05/15/08 11:02 PM Re: ulp [Re: ineffable]
mogigo Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 04/24/07
Posts: 1331
Loc: Colorado
Hey, no worries this way Craig, was just trying to maybe put a different spin on it so it might not be so.....personal?

Maybe those surface question's would be a really good place to start, not too revealing, not too problematic? Being challenged is a good way to recieve some good feedback about ourselves. People that can challenge us usually are trying to offer some constructive opinion's, and if the feedback is taken in the proper context (caring) it can be a good way to move forward with our stuff. Maybe the answers to those questions weren't really the point.

I talked once in a post about taking a step out of our comfort zone and then taking one more step. It seems that those "surface" questions might be a step out of your's. Could be a nice safe way to take that first step.

I had always wondered what you might say if you tried to describe what was ineffable about you? Sorry that might be a tough one.

Feel free to PM Craig but thought it might be good here.

One more step Craig

Love ya
Stay strong
Mike

PS: as you know, you can always tell me to shut up anytime you want

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#224705 - 05/17/08 11:05 AM Re: ulp [Re: mogigo]
arronb Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 02/02/08
Posts: 1005
Loc: Perth
Intimacy … vulnerability … selfworth … trust …
Bang … big deflect

Hello Craig …

I am glad you’ve taken up Brians challenge … it was a great first effort.

I think you can take it further, because as someone who cares about you I’ve noted
it’s a rather impersonal personal post.

‘so here goes nothing’ – ppplease … you are far from nothing Craig, it’s a theme you presented thru out this post, I think I’ll take the opportunity to set ya straight here, you are one of the most caring individuals I have come across, by helping others you are helping yourself and if you truly felt you were worth nothing, you wouldn’t make the effort.

In your ineffable style you have bought up some issues you struggle with …
Intimacy, vulnerability, self worth and trust.

Yet in your usual ineffable style you have thrown in a big deflect with terms like ‘they were all very "surface" questions’ and ‘being interrogated’ thus insuring nobody asks you any questions, probing or otherwise. As a friend my comment about your posts would be “I love how you ask a question, answer it youself, but we are left with more questions that can’t be asked” …

Moggie had you by the short and curlys with his “I had always wondered what you might say if you tried to describe what was ineffable about you?” question but he gave you an out with … “Sorry that might be a tough one.” Which I note you’ve duly accepted.

So my friend … lets get personal … how about trying to answer this question without taking the easy ‘outs’

I had always wondered what you might say if you tried to describe what was ineffable about you?

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arronb

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#224714 - 05/17/08 11:36 AM Re: ulp [Re: arronb]
ak Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 01/10/04
Posts: 1491
Craig,

I have never thought of you as an 'unpersonal' person, and have never felt uncomfortable with what amount or such you choose to share here. I have been fortunate to be able to have some 'conversation' with you in PM, and think you are very intelligent, very questioning, very honest about yourself, even if you are not sharing so much details. You present as an honest, flawed, amazing person, and I do not need to know what is your favorite color, or what kind of vegetable you hate to know how I feel of you.

But it do seem that this is issue to you, something you are feeling strong things about, and as such as that, I am glad that you are making the 'leap' to personalizing more here. Because no matter how 'deep' or superficial we may present, no matter how much of our soul we offer to others or not, in the end, it is us ourself that we can not escape from, and so must answer to our own expectation of our character. (Um. That I think probably do not make sense, but at least I know what I am meaning! Maybe after some weeks of PM with me, you do also!)

There are people who have been here for years and have not shared so much deep and personal things of themselves, their past or present. It is all with what we are comfortable with, because to push ourself to more, that is rather like a self-abuse I think. I am very happy with getting to know whatever you feel you can share. And you are worth it for me to wait for the rest.

andrei


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#224723 - 05/17/08 12:35 PM Re: ulp [Re: ak]
Freedom49 Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 12/30/07
Posts: 2723
Loc: Washington State
Craig,
I have notice that in one on on situations you can and do get personal to an extent. I have been bless with that with our chats on occasion.


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#224830 - 05/18/08 11:25 AM Re: ulp [Re: Freedom49]
ineffable Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 02/07/08
Posts: 1371
Loc: state of holeecrapdood
Ineffable - that which can't be put into words
I chose this because I have been through a lot of therapy
I believed (& I still do somewhat) that if I found "THE" answer it/I would be ok
The term serves to remind me that that which I am searching for may be just that
Unable to be put into words

I also believe there is a "location" inside myself where I feel from
My "co-ordinates", kinda like the GPS of my being
The location of my conception, I carry it
It is the centre of my consciousness
It's why I do yoga, meditate & head/handstands
To try to feel where I feel my being from (which is different from where I think from)

I believe we are "mantenna's" (think antenna & extrapolate)
Our senses, the electrical activity in our brains, the electromagnetic field of our hearts, the polarity of our blood
Emotions, desire, the heebie jeebies, the hair that stands up on the back of our heads
Goosebumps
Laughter
The 5 F's
Do I want to fight you? feast on you? flee from you? freeze in front of you? or frack you?
A good friend suggested a 6th one.
Do I want to be friends with you

I have talked myself out of feelings
& talked myself around feelings
& talked about my feelings
Relatively, I haven't talked much while in my feelings
Fragments in therapy & holee crap sometimes here at MS
(dang you Frost & Gav & Ben & Roger & Andrei & Mike & Scott & Jarrad & Brown & Hauser & Texas Ninja & ...)

About therapy
I have been going into the abuse memories deep deep deep in the last 3 years
My T's most recent comment was that most people get better doing that
I have only gotten worse
I take that to mean I am not dealing with the deeper or real issues

I have though accepted that a normal life aint in the cards fer me
but a life is
& like my friend Ben I hold the cards to that life

I want love
I want to be loved
I want to love
I have felt love here
I have felt loved here
It has terrified me
It has brought me to tears
It's what keeps me here

There will be more

C


_________________________
:: "Anyone who can handle a needle convincingly can make us see a thread which is not there" ::


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#224844 - 05/18/08 12:43 PM Re: ulp [Re: ineffable]
mogigo Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 04/24/07
Posts: 1331
Loc: Colorado
\:\) \:\) \:\) \:\) wonderful!!! and the more we know you the more lovable you are. Sounds like a plan.

It's hard and scary and and and, but the adult Craig is very very capable of handling it and keeping you safe.

Very impressed and proud of you Craig

Love Ya
Mike

PS: Me and Aaron are coming for ya Jarrad

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#225024 - 05/19/08 08:54 AM Re: ulp [Re: mogigo]
Lazarus Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 07/01/07
Posts: 851
Loc: Below the radar, USA
That's a hard one to follow when time is limited, but...

I consider everyone who has posted to this thread a dear friend, some of my best friends ever. Mike, you are much wiser and nicer than I thought of you at first, my bad. Arron, gotten any polystyrene yet? (inside joke.) Roger, I hope you're feeling better; I know I am. AK I love your accent and even at it's thickest your caring and widsom always comes through loud and clear. And Craig;

That was a beautiful post, something ineffable that was actually put into words very eloquently. Don't you worry about a thing, my friend. I hope you don't take diagnostic surveys that seriously! I should have made it multiple choice... I think it was mostly because these innocent little interrogations were coming from me that you put so much weight on them. Why is that? Well, I think I know, but it's not relevant to this discussion. PM me!

Craig, you see my life in ways that I don't see. I empathize with a lot of things you are feeling, but if I were as complex as you make me out to be, that empathy would be antithetical, wouldn't it? I live a pretty normal life, with normal duties and obligations, and with seriously screwed desires and expectations. And, I have kids, which impacts everything about me. How did I get up on this pedastal, and could somebody please get me a step-stool??? LOL

We know a lot about you, Craig. We all still like (love) you for exactly who you are. I wish I could convince you not to be so hyperanalytical, but how would I do that since I'm the same way. I love your introspection, and I love the way you verbalize the results. Sometimes I cringe at your conclusions, though. But hey, it's your life.

Gotta run. Love you guys. Love you, C.

Lazarus W.W.L.L. Smith, esq.

aka Ric



Edited by Lazarus (05/19/08 03:29 PM)
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