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#205882 - 02/18/08 02:40 PM "symptom" Question
usmc97 Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 08/02/05
Posts: 437
Loc: Colorado
Is their anyone that actually relives what happened to them?

I don't mean bad overwhelming memories or body memories or nightterrors or "acting out" or intrusive pictures or out of body experience or third person view or self mutilation or hellucinations.... etc.

I mean the real deal, complete, literal, all inclusive acts outside of anything most people can understand.

_________________________
Semper Fi

The statistics? 1 in 4, 1 in 6?
...then there's me the imaginary number

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#205909 - 02/18/08 04:54 PM Re: "symptom" Question [Re: usmc97]
OKIE MIKE Offline
Member

Registered: 02/13/04
Posts: 979
Loc: HULBERT OK
I have the same night mare some times as much as 6 to 8 times a month. and they are very real to me. What You are describeing is called a flash back . and Yes I have ben there NO I don't want to go back. No one that has not experienced PTSD could hope to understand it


US.ARMY 76

_________________________
MICHAEL

"I HAD NO SHOES THEN I SAW A MAN THAT HAD NO FEET"

"All I can do is be me, whoever that is"

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#206005 - 02/19/08 12:10 AM Re: "symptom" Question [Re: OKIE MIKE]
thecoopstah Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 07/19/04
Posts: 589
Loc: massachusetts
I,too agree emphatically that no one that does not have PTSD can/will understand...i have had literally hundreds of flashbacks...

IE....cold sweats,being chased,chest pain,hyperventilating,cant catch my breath,throat feels like it will close at times,.....every last one of these symptoms are indicative of PTSD...so yes i have had nightmares,etc etc etc
Thecoopstah

_________________________
" You never know how strong you are until being strong is the only choice you have "

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#206010 - 02/19/08 12:21 AM Re: "symptom" Question [Re: thecoopstah]
usmc97 Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 08/02/05
Posts: 437
Loc: Colorado
I wasn't talking about flashbacks either, I have those aside from what I was trying to explain. I don't feel that anyone gets me. It's lonely.

_________________________
Semper Fi

The statistics? 1 in 4, 1 in 6?
...then there's me the imaginary number

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#206474 - 02/20/08 09:53 PM Re: "symptom" Question [Re: usmc97]
Chester Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 10/28/07
Posts: 48
Loc: Long Island, NY
Be more specific. Your topic says "symptom", but you seem to be suggesting what happened to you keeps happening. Do you mean alone or with another person? Or am I totally off base?

_________________________
rock: left pocket

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#206528 - 02/21/08 01:48 AM Re: "symptom" Question [Re: Chester]
usmc97 Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 08/02/05
Posts: 437
Loc: Colorado
I do mean that what happened to me keeps happening, I don't know how else to explain when being specific. I simplify it and I just get more questions. I've tried to give specifics in other posts and I still don't get understood. Either form I mean exactly what I say.

Whether someone is there or not doesn't matter anymore because the damage is "as if" there was.... rationally there is no one visible and I do not do anything to myself during sleep. The evidence says my perps do it to me.

I try to state what's NOT wrong with me because folks jump to conclusions. I don't have any chemical inbalance or anything else other than my diagnosis of "severely acute PTSD" but that don't justify it because that was given more because they don't have anything else to call it. I've been on every med you can think of. I've been in therapy for years and jumped through every hoop possible to find that this "symptom" has only attached itself to me with no relief in sight. I'm trying to find that I'm not alone with this curse. I know everybody on this site has issues but in all these years nothing has come across as the same. It's frustrating, I live so scared.

_________________________
Semper Fi

The statistics? 1 in 4, 1 in 6?
...then there's me the imaginary number

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#334095 - 06/18/10 05:27 PM Re: "symptom" Question [Re: usmc97]
SamV Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 12/13/09
Posts: 5942
Loc: Talladega, Alabama, USA
Scared, yes, my dear brother, but not alone, and believed.

Sam

_________________________
MaleSurvivor Moderator Emeritus 2012 - 2014

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#334184 - 06/19/10 06:51 PM Re: "symptom" Question [Re: usmc97]
kidneythis Offline


Registered: 11/08/09
Posts: 1558
Let me disclose first. I am finding that the wild things that my mind has always thrown at me and I considered an active imagination are in fact flashbacks and fearful reactive imaginings. I got so used to ignoring them I don't hardly notice them. But I see they do harm me by makeing me unable to concentrate and make things difficult. I think I also have dreams in which I relive events.

"Whether someone is there or not doesn't matter anymore because the damage is "as if" there was.... rationally there is no one visible and I do not do anything to myself during sleep. The evidence says my perps do it to me."

USMC97,
I think it is important whether or not someone is there. Chester was asking because if it is someone there you are being assaulted and should act to protect yourself and report it. If no one is there it is a reliving of past events which needs some kind of therapy.

What is the evidence? You aren't as clear as I need to understand. That sentence I quoted is confusing.
From what I see you wake up with new damage to your body and whatever evidence you find indicates your abusers did this damage to you. By "your abusers" I expect you are talking about those whose abuse lead you to MS.
If this is so,
Why do your abusers still have access to you and why don't you wake up during the night when it is happening?

_________________________
As Mark Twain once quipped, history may not repeat itself, but it does rhyme.

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#334246 - 06/20/10 05:52 PM Re: "symptom" Question [Re: kidneythis]
usmc97 Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 08/02/05
Posts: 437
Loc: Colorado
"they" "them"... refers to the worst of those who did things to me, a rather large group of men.

I ment whether somebody wants to call "them" ghost, spirits, flesh n blood, demonic, etc.... it just don't matter what "they" are or what they are constructed from, the fact is that "they" are real and capable of the things that "they" do to me.

The damage done is things that people don't really want to hear which consist of things both internal and external, so I've said things about the other evidence, markings and things not done by skin conditions, body memory, or the like.

You ask the last question as if I have a choice, I've never had a choice then or now.

None of it makes sense, it's not logical, it's not rationalized... it just is. My issues are only partially mental, sometimes it seems that that is unacceptable.

_________________________
Semper Fi

The statistics? 1 in 4, 1 in 6?
...then there's me the imaginary number

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#334261 - 06/20/10 07:04 PM Re: "symptom" Question [Re: usmc97]
kidneythis Offline


Registered: 11/08/09
Posts: 1558
Well the last question was meant to find out if it is a current abuse situation. I see now it doesn't sound like that. Sorry if I insulted you it does come across badly.
If it is the case that it is current then we know you need protection since the train of your thread indicates you cannot get away. We can ask the people who run this site for help in getting you out of that situation.
If it isn't a current abuse situation then it's a mental presence and that requires someone with training to help you deal with these phantoms. I think it is commonly called flashbacks and reliving. This is a known symptomology that has known effective treatments.

The choice you have is to act in some way to help yourself or not to act.

_________________________
As Mark Twain once quipped, history may not repeat itself, but it does rhyme.

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#334266 - 06/20/10 07:43 PM Re: "symptom" Question [Re: kidneythis]
usmc97 Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 08/02/05
Posts: 437
Loc: Colorado
This aspect is NOT MENTAL, I'm not delusional with this stuff, its documented. It is real and physical to my exact de>
_________________________
Semper Fi

The statistics? 1 in 4, 1 in 6?
...then there's me the imaginary number

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#334268 - 06/20/10 08:20 PM Re: "symptom" Question [Re: usmc97]
kidneythis Offline


Registered: 11/08/09
Posts: 1558
So its not mental and it sin't anyone currently abusing you?

Then what do you think is happening?

_________________________
As Mark Twain once quipped, history may not repeat itself, but it does rhyme.

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#334272 - 06/20/10 08:32 PM Re: "symptom" Question [Re: kidneythis]
kidneythis Offline


Registered: 11/08/09
Posts: 1558
Here is your original post;

"Is their anyone that actually relives what happened to them?

I don't mean bad overwhelming memories or body memories or nightterrors or "acting out" or intrusive pictures or out of body experience or third person view or self mutilation or hellucinations.... etc.

I mean the real deal, complete, literal, all inclusive acts outside of anything most people can understand"


It seems to be outside what I have understood up to this point in life. The two things I have suggested are pretty much the extent of my ideas except for Sleep Sex.





Edited by kidneythis (06/20/10 09:13 PM)
_________________________
As Mark Twain once quipped, history may not repeat itself, but it does rhyme.

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#334280 - 06/20/10 11:13 PM Re: "symptom" Question [Re: kidneythis]
usmc97 Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 08/02/05
Posts: 437
Loc: Colorado
It don't matter what to call it or what I say is happening when nobody knows what it is in the first place. PTSD barely touches on trying to explain what I go through, even then it's classified as something which cause is "mental" and therefore treatable by common means.

I'll quote myself
Originally Posted By: usmc97
I don't mean bad overwhelming memories or body memories or nightterrors or "acting out" or intrusive pictures or out of body experience or third person view or self mutilation or hellucinations.... etc.

I mean the real deal, complete, literal, all inclusive acts outside of anything most people can understand"


I say what it is and nobody has ever heard of it, the only responses are what others hold as similar to what they experience. Those assumptions lead to falsely identifying what I go through because the concept of being this much different than others is too hard to accept.

_________________________
Semper Fi

The statistics? 1 in 4, 1 in 6?
...then there's me the imaginary number

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#334310 - 06/21/10 09:39 AM Re: "symptom" Question [Re: usmc97]
kidneythis Offline


Registered: 11/08/09
Posts: 1558
"I say what it is and nobody has ever heard of it, the only responses are what others hold as similar to what they experience. Those assumptions lead to falsely identifying what I go through because the concept of being this much different than others is too hard to accept."

You haven't said "what it is" here what you have given are de>


Edited by kidneythis (06/21/10 10:44 AM)
_________________________
As Mark Twain once quipped, history may not repeat itself, but it does rhyme.

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#334336 - 06/21/10 02:39 PM Re: "symptom" Question [Re: kidneythis]
usmc97 Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 08/02/05
Posts: 437
Loc: Colorado
PTSD does not give explanation to my body being raped, tortured, and mutilated. I have tried to say over and over that I'm not talking about mere sensations and used the term "reliving" for lack of a better word. The evidence is the physical damage being freshly done to me specific to what I experience while in the presence of "them".

Am I suppose to give the graphic details of the damage... can't that be figured out from what I've said already about what they did to me as a kid and now presently? Am I suppose to be examined each time? Or show the pictures?

I do not have DID or anything else to write off the harm done to me physically. That is why it is not mental. I have flashbacks and body memory sensations on top of having to go through this stuff, I know the difference.

I'm sorry if this is just so unbelievable. I know how crazy I sound but it's the truth.

_________________________
Semper Fi

The statistics? 1 in 4, 1 in 6?
...then there's me the imaginary number

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#334340 - 06/21/10 03:00 PM Re: "symptom" Question [Re: usmc97]
kidneythis Offline


Registered: 11/08/09
Posts: 1558
Its not unbelievable you just are not being clear. It seems to me you are being as cryptic as possible about how this damage is happening to you.

"The evidence is the physical damage being freshly done to me specific to what I experience while in the presence of "them". "

That is a very cryptic sentence. So lets parse it.
Part one; [The evidence is the physical damage being freshly done to me]
1)What exactly is the physical damage.
2)Name any injury that is occuring.
3)Do you go to a doctor when you have new injuries?

Part Two; [ specific to what I experience ]
4)Exactly what are you experiencing in any single event of this happening?

Part Three; [while in the presence of "them". ]
5)When are you in the presence of "them"?
6)Do you have any idea who "them" are?
7)Where are you when you are in the presence of "them"?
8)What are you doing when this happens?




Edited by kidneythis (06/21/10 03:04 PM)
_________________________
As Mark Twain once quipped, history may not repeat itself, but it does rhyme.

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#334357 - 06/21/10 07:29 PM Re: "symptom" Question [Re: kidneythis]
usmc97 Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 08/02/05
Posts: 437
Loc: Colorado
I will possibly delete this, way more detail than I'm comfortable giving though I've described things multiple times.

*********may trigger************

1. and 2. Mutilation of my throat, genitals, and rear, both internally and externally. Burns, cuts bruising, markings from "tools" and use of body parts and inanimate objects, bleeding from the injuries with no other medical reasons. I don't know what you want me to list... if I got stepped on with a boot I can return with tread marks.

3. I have seen physicians in the past specifically for these things, see one occasionally now for general health. I have now been on pain meds to try and help with the damage. What has made sense to most them is either I am allowing someone to do these things or somehow I do them to myself, neither are true but those are the logical conclusions.

4. I am being raped and tortured by five to eight+ adult men repeatedly and subject to the things they want to do under the rules they abide by, including ways of killing me under supervision to be able to bring me back. All things originally done and now done again.

5. I am basically in their presence whenever I am unconscious in this reality, knocked out, 'sleeping", or sedated.

6. They are all among those within the group I've spoken of who originally did these things to me. My first perp is not there and neither is the priest who was the last perp.

7. I am in the place where it all originally happened, a basement in some house. I was never allowed to know the address and never allowed to see any of their faces.

8. While they do what they do I am fully at their mercy, restrained, held down, strapped, hanging, caged, chained, etc. Each session is customized to who is in attendance.

I do not feel that I am "cryptic" in what I say, you and others will still probably come to the same conclusions. I speak about it as best I can and always find that I'm having to prove myself and the things I go through and still get judged as being unacceptable or completely mental... I'm here because where else do I have to go?

_________________________
Semper Fi

The statistics? 1 in 4, 1 in 6?
...then there's me the imaginary number

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#334360 - 06/21/10 07:50 PM Re: "symptom" Question [Re: usmc97]
kidneythis Offline


Registered: 11/08/09
Posts: 1558
Thank you for taking the time to respond. I am not sure what to make of it I think I need to ponder it for a while. You don't have to prove anything to me.

_________________________
As Mark Twain once quipped, history may not repeat itself, but it does rhyme.

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#334382 - 06/22/10 04:05 AM Re: "symptom" Question [Re: kidneythis]
TheBobcatAgain Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 02/13/10
Posts: 506
Loc: AZ, U.S.A.
Kevin,

I've already told you many times that I believe you, and I still do. I've known you for a few months, and your story has never changed, not one bit. Add to that, there are many things in this world which are not easily explained - your abuse is one of those for me. Lastly, if you say what's happening to you now is true, who am I to say it's not? I don't know everything.

So you don't have to prove anything to me either, buddy. I'm sure you will continue to be asked questions about possible solutions and given suggestions on what might "really" be happening to you - all things you've heard many times before. We're just trying to help you, because we don't want you to suffer anymore. We love you, buddy.

And no doubt you will meet people who disbelieve you completely and/or think that you are making all of this up. But the good part is that, sometimes, you will meet someone who DOES believe you, and wants to be your friend. Like me, and some others on this site, buddy. You've got friends here.

Kevin, I think about you a lot. I even dream sometimes of helping you escape this torture. I probably won't be the one to save you from your troubles; but if I can do nothing else, at the very least, I can do this: ((((((((((Kevin))))))))))

Your loving brother, as always,

Bobcat


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#334445 - 06/22/10 08:18 PM Re: "symptom" Question [Re: TheBobcatAgain]
WalkingSouth Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 08/30/05
Posts: 16264
usmc97,

First of all let me say that I believe you. You describe things that are happening in your life, damage to your body, etc. I would have been a skeptic except for a session I sat through in NYC at the MaleSurvivor Conference two months ago.

One of the seminars I attended was presented by a man named Robert Oxnam. Former president of the Asia Society, he organized, among other things, Financial/Cultural tours of China for Bill Gates, Warren Buffet, and former President George H. W. Bush. He is also the author of a book titled "A Fractured Mind".

In the Seminar and in the book he described awaking from deep sleep to find his body burned, bruised, and otherwise injured, a condition he had not been in when he fell asleep. He described things that happened to him that for many years were completely unexplainable. They caused him great concern, worry, and shame, as well as caused him to seek the numbing relief in addictive behaviors.

You might visit your local bookstore or Amazon.com and order a copy of the book. Perhaps within you may find some of the answers to the frustrations you face.

You deserve some answers, Friend. I hope you are able to find them.

John

_________________________
“Life’s journey is not to arrive at the grave safely in a well preserved body, but rather to skid in sideways, totally worn out, shouting ‘Holy ____…! What a ride!’” ~Hunter S. Thompson

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#334459 - 06/23/10 01:37 AM Re: "symptom" Question [Re: WalkingSouth]
usmc97 Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 08/02/05
Posts: 437
Loc: Colorado
There is nothing in common with the guy mentioned from the conference you attended. I DO NOT have Multiple Personalities a.k.a. D.I.D. I have never had an addiction or used any substance to alter my mind. I have soberly had to go through this stuff without any habitual or behavioral "acting out". I DO NOT do anything to damage myself consciously or unconsciously.

So much of what I hear in response seems to question my sanity and integrity. That is why the few who say they believe me don't counterbalance the majority who come to their conclusions. That doubt is what has me in the place where evidently " I do not exist".

I hope that my frustration shows but that it don't offend.

It's so hard to not be listened to word for word, and to not be accepted or understood. Please try not to compare or have me look toward folks like this who have no similarities to what I've been saying all these years. I am not stupid and have done everything to investigate what these things are and what, if anything, is possible that can help me.

_________________________
Semper Fi

The statistics? 1 in 4, 1 in 6?
...then there's me the imaginary number

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#334460 - 06/23/10 01:56 AM Re: "symptom" Question [Re: usmc97]
WalkingSouth Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 08/30/05
Posts: 16264
usmc97,

You have asked to be listened to. I hear you. Tho I do not understand, I believe you as I'm sure many of your brothers here do. I think the question that would be good for all of us to ask is this, "What do you need from us?" Tho we cannot be there in person to support we'd like to be able to support in whatever way we can in this text medium. What is it that would be most helpful that might be in our power to provide?

_________________________
“Life’s journey is not to arrive at the grave safely in a well preserved body, but rather to skid in sideways, totally worn out, shouting ‘Holy ____…! What a ride!’” ~Hunter S. Thompson

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#334462 - 06/23/10 03:04 AM Re: "symptom" Question [Re: WalkingSouth]
BigV Offline


Registered: 07/19/09
Posts: 63
usmc97, I believe you, completely. If you say you're experiencing this, then you are, and your sanity is not in question. No further explanation is required.

Please, try to have patience with your brothers, here, people are asking for explanations in the hopes that an explanation will help them to help you. But if I understand what you've been saying, you are simply asking that we understand the uniqueness of your experiences. I will not attempt to debate that with you, they are your experiences; if you say so, then they are unique. That is for you, and only you to know, understand, and assert.

I will not attempt to force conformity on this sense of self you have; it does not have to fit in with what we all think we understand. I could think of a million things that it might be, but that's not what you're asking for, so I won't attempt to analyze what you have said.

Being judged, or having your experiences judged in any way is obviously not going to help you, at least I don't think it will.

So you know your body has these residual marks and bruises, your mind has the faint memories, the sense of people, men in the room, and so fourth. If that's all you can and want to say for now, that's fine. And I won't claim to know exactly what it is like to have your experiences; I have no right to say that.

usmc97, I don't know if I have this right, or if I understand you, but I am not going to judge you, expect you to make logical sense, or to give sensible explanations. The thing is that what you've said DOES make sense. It's like nothing I've heard of, or experienced, but you are making sense. Personal experiences can be incredibly frustrating to put into words, especially when they defy the logic of others.

The only thing I'd like to encourage you to do is to keep writing and posting. Please keep doing so, regardless of how rational or irrational you think it might seem to others.


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#334464 - 06/23/10 05:09 AM Re: "symptom" Question [Re: BigV]
usmc97 Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 08/02/05
Posts: 437
Loc: Colorado
It's like there is this urge for me to exhaust all avenues. I have always been a problem solver which did me very well in the military. From the start I sought help by using every means available. Back then I never thought things could be this bad, back then I could have related to others here very easily, but very quickly it turned into this stuff. I have fought and fought and fought to try to battle through all of this and haven't gotten anywhere.

In asking questions and describing things it is partially having to try and release what I feel I'm expected to keep silent about. In some ways I've sought to try and find that I'm not alone and that there really is somekind of hope... I get told all the time "you're can't be the only one" but when it comes down to it that seems like a lie. The same goes with "there's always hope", it's like a stalling tactic. I never claimed to be worse than anybody.... just honestly different.

My friends closest to me I just want as much time with them as I can get. I feel safe with them, that's my relief, nothing comes close to that.

On here I don't want to feel like I have to prove and defend everything. If I don't stay within the confines of things it's like I'm ousted from being acceptable. If I lie and say things just to fit in then what's it worth? I'm sorry I don't relate to very much but I can't force it.

My doctor and friends have come to tell me at times that I am not like other people.... in a good way for some things and then an awful way in that my reality seems so hard to understand or accept. It's left me pretty deprived in getting the relief and medical attention that I need. It also makes for having to try and maintain things in the gap of what can be provided.

It does take a certain amount of faith to believe me and trust in my sanity. If all could see me as the Marine I am and always have that in consideration, it would make for an easier understanding and faith in my integrity.

_________________________
Semper Fi

The statistics? 1 in 4, 1 in 6?
...then there's me the imaginary number

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