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#202388 - 01/29/08 08:04 PM Online predator
Stephen_5 Offline
BoD Emeritus
MaleSurvivor
Registered: 09/12/00
Posts: 667
Loc: Northern California Foothills
I just read this potential new law requiring convicted sex offenders to register all of their internet identities so that they can be kept off of the social networking sites. It sounds good but what about the enforcement? Again, this only targets the ones that have already been convicted.

http://money.excite.com/jsp/nw/nwdt_rt_t...ias/money/cm/nw

Steve

_________________________
I want to stay as close to the edge as I can without going over. Out on the edge you see all kinds of things you can't see from the center.
Kurt Vonnegut (1922-2007)

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#202396 - 01/29/08 08:23 PM Re: Online predator [Re: Stephen_5]
Trish4850 Offline
BoD Liaison Emeritus
MaleSurvivor<

Registered: 10/15/05
Posts: 3280
Loc: New Jersey
I think laws without teeth are useless and nothing more than a rub to try and make someone feel good. On-line identities can be changed and/or modified in seconds either with intent or on a whim. Trusting that already un-trustworthy individuals will do as you ask is incredibly foolish. The article even says that the offenders they want to track are under no obligation to even provide IP addresses. That, to me, would have to be a basic piece of information authorities would need to have in order to hold out any hope of tracking even a small percentage of them.

Someone had a brain fart but never followed through on how to make it work in the real world.

ROCK ON.......Trish

_________________________
If you fall down 10 times, Stand up 11.

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#202416 - 01/29/08 09:36 PM Re: Online predator [Re: Trish4850]
Freedom49 Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 12/30/07
Posts: 2723
Loc: Washington State
What a waste of time. Sheesh

Roger


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#202420 - 01/29/08 09:46 PM Re: Online predator [Re: Freedom49]
theatrekid Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 06/03/07
Posts: 702
Loc: oregon
Personally i think if people wanted to truly stop sexual offenders we would punish them for there crimes but when they are released back into society instead of isolating them we should offer them treatment. I obviously think it is important to make sure they aren't putting kids in danger. However i think all the system dose now is isolate and make it more likely for them to re-offend.

Thats my thoughts, Christopher


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#202427 - 01/29/08 10:11 PM Re: Online predator [Re: theatrekid]
James_dup1 Offline


Registered: 04/13/02
Posts: 1332
Loc: Wyoming
I wonder a few things in this post.

1st

Quote:
Again, this only targets the ones that have already been convicted.


I guess this statement confuses me. Who else would it target? Surely you don't mean to imply that people who are in treatment for sexual attractions to children should fall under this law if they haven't broken any.

2nd

Quote:
instead of isolating them we should offer them treatment


How very true Christopher. And make sure the T is trained in treating offenders.

Quote:
i think all the system dose now is isolate and make it more likely for them to re-offend.


Not only does it set them up to possibility 're-offend' but it is also set up in such a way that it "isolates" the person who has feelings like this and could set them up to offend for the first time.

Sorry to get on my soap box.

James

_________________________
I have more issues than Rolling Stone!


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#202450 - 01/29/08 11:22 PM Re: Online predator [Re: James_dup1]
AndyJB2005 Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 11/14/06
Posts: 1242
Loc: Saint Paul, Minnesota
We need to stop seeking the bogeyman online, less than 1000 feet from a school or park, or freakin' driving the white vans, and start looking inside OUR homes...where it REALLY goes on. But no one wants to think that THEIR family could be like that. Why never! Let's blame the internet!

Sheesh.

_________________________
Life's disappointments are harder to take when you don't know any swear words. -- Calvin (Calvin and Hobbes)

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#202542 - 01/30/08 09:46 AM Re: Online predator [Re: AndyJB2005]
Trish4850 Offline
BoD Liaison Emeritus
MaleSurvivor<

Registered: 10/15/05
Posts: 3280
Loc: New Jersey
I agree that treatment is necessary for offenders and that it can help. However, there are certain sexual predators out there who will not benefit from such treatment because they don't think there's anything wrong with them. There are evil people in this world. Yes, it's a small percentage, thank G_d, but those people need to be tracked. The sad fact is that by the time they're caught, they've damaged maybe hundreds of young lives, to allow them the opportunity to ruin one more is not acceptable.

Now, how do you separate out the ones who can be helped vs. the ones who cannot or will not be helped without some oversight system in place? When you figure it out, let me know.

ROCK ON.........Trish

_________________________
If you fall down 10 times, Stand up 11.

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#202609 - 01/30/08 02:46 PM Re: Online predator [Re: AndyJB2005]
roadrunner Offline
Administrator Emeritus
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 05/02/05
Posts: 22045
Loc: Carlisle, PA
Originally Posted By: AndyJB2005
We need to stop seeking the bogeyman online, less than 1000 feet from a school or park, or freakin' driving the white vans, and start looking inside OUR homes...where it REALLY goes on. But no one wants to think that THEIR family could be like that. Why never! Let's blame the internet!


What he said ^ ^ ^ !!!

More than 90% of abused kids are molested by someone they know, and usually the abuse occurs in a place familiar to them.

One thing that astonishes me is the way pedophiles set up their own fantasy world allowing them to believe that they will not be caught, even though they have heard about how chat rooms are full of vice cops these days (for example). The cops bust a guy in his home and what do they find on his PC? Records of every kid he has molested, including intimate details that could only be known through abuse. What are these guys thinking?

I doubt they will be deterred by new registers of Internet identities, just as they have not been deterred by Megan's Law requirements.

Trish makes the good point that some of these dangerous characters do need to be tracked, but who will do that? The police departments that ought to be responsible are already flooded with work and limited by ever-expanding budget cuts.

Much love,
Larry

_________________________
Nobody living can ever stop me
As I go walking my freedom highway.
Nobody living can make me turn back:
This land was made for you and me.
(Woody Guthrie)

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#202619 - 01/30/08 03:10 PM Re: Online predator [Re: roadrunner]
AndyJB2005 Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 11/14/06
Posts: 1242
Loc: Saint Paul, Minnesota
Originally Posted By: roadrunner
The police departments that ought to be responsible are already flooded with work and limited by ever-expanding budget cuts.


Agreed! And when we focus our police forces in wrong directions, it's easy to miss what really needs to be watched. They are completely overwhelmed by how many people they have to watch because of new and useless laws, in my opinion. Then we get mad when they don't/can't do their jobs.

_________________________
Life's disappointments are harder to take when you don't know any swear words. -- Calvin (Calvin and Hobbes)

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#202641 - 01/30/08 06:04 PM Re: Online predator [Re: AndyJB2005]
Lazarus Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 07/01/07
Posts: 851
Loc: Below the radar, USA
How about putting monitoring bracelets on everyone convicted of a sex crime? They don't have to be kept under house arrest, but when they are 'out and about' for whatever reason, there will be record of where they've been. THAT ought to help keep these folks out of trouble, it's cheap and doesn't require much manpower.

Just a thought,

Lazarus

_________________________
"That which does not kill us, surely makes us stonger." - Neitsche

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#202645 - 01/30/08 06:28 PM Re: Online predator [Re: Lazarus]
theatrekid Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 06/03/07
Posts: 702
Loc: oregon
Lazarus I'm all for tough sentencing, probation, and keeping track of people that are dangerous to society.
But I think putting monitoring bracelets on people that have done their time already is unconstitutional, and very dangerous.

It starts with our perps getting these bracelets, but who is to stop it from then being other people that have been released from prison? people with drug charges? and then after that what next? all citizens have to wear a bracelet to "protect" them? Thats not a world i want any part of. I think education and well funded treatment programs is a much smarter way to handle sexual abuse in our country.

thats my thought any ways sorry if i sounded to Orwellian.


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#202698 - 01/30/08 09:19 PM Re: Online predator [Re: theatrekid]
Lazarus Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 07/01/07
Posts: 851
Loc: Below the radar, USA
No, actually you are right. I didn't think it all the way through.

Oh well, that was my best solution. Besides treatment programs, education is also very important. I didn't know that my abuse was criminal then; hopefully every 9 yr old on the planet knows it by now.

No apologies, Christopher.

Lazarus

_________________________
"That which does not kill us, surely makes us stonger." - Neitsche

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#202710 - 01/30/08 10:18 PM Re: Online predator [Re: Lazarus]
theatrekid Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 06/03/07
Posts: 702
Loc: oregon
I'M right? oh wow i need a second lol... im not used to hearing this one \:\) thanks lazarus

christopher


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#202751 - 01/31/08 07:42 AM Re: Online predator [Re: theatrekid]
Lazarus Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 07/01/07
Posts: 851
Loc: Below the radar, USA
Hey Christopher,

Did you say you needed a second lol or a seconal? (I don't have my glasses... LOL)

Laz

_________________________
"That which does not kill us, surely makes us stonger." - Neitsche

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#202855 - 01/31/08 03:57 PM Re: Online predator [Re: Stephen_5]
reality2k4 Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 07/06/04
Posts: 6838
Loc: Stuck between water, air, and ...
I haven't read the legislation, but I am sure it would only affect those convicted of similar offences, or actual predators.
That is how it works in the UK, but don't forget the civil liberty, or human rights issues, as we call it.

Let us not forget, that most "real" abuse, is happening in kids own homes, by their own family.
The message gives the familiar sigh, of, the whining flock, baying, Oh, they are doing something positive in the arraigning child abusers.

NOT!

In MY humble oppinion,

ste

_________________________
Whoever stole the Sun, put it back and we'll drop all the charges!

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#202965 - 01/31/08 11:57 PM Re: Online predator [Re: reality2k4]
theatrekid Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 06/03/07
Posts: 702
Loc: oregon
SECOND lol


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#203100 - 02/01/08 10:21 PM Re: Online predator [Re: roadrunner]
WalkingSouth Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 08/30/05
Posts: 16264
Quote:
One thing that astonishes me is the way pedophiles set up their own fantasy world allowing them to believe that they will not be caught, even though they have heard about how chat rooms are full of vice cops these days (for example). The cops bust a guy in his home and what do they find on his PC? Records of every kid he has molested, including intimate details that could only be known through abuse. What are these guys thinking?

That is the rub right there, Larry. I have a brother in law who is doing 15 years for sexually abusing his own son. He told his sister (my wife) that he figured no one would catch him because he was such a nobody no one would be looking for him. It goes to show that perhaps the sense of self worth of these guys actually contributes to their ultimate demise. "I'm a worthless nobody so why would they look for me to be doing anything?" It doesn't make much sense but in the end what about this does?

_________________________
“Life’s journey is not to arrive at the grave safely in a well preserved body, but rather to skid in sideways, totally worn out, shouting ‘Holy ____…! What a ride!’” ~Hunter S. Thompson

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#203151 - 02/02/08 10:44 AM Re: Online predator [Re: WalkingSouth]
Ken Singer, LCSW Offline
Moderator Emeritus
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 08/24/00
Posts: 5777
Loc: Lambertville, NJ USA
Just one quick comment on the electronic monitoring stuff. We have that in NJ via Parole for the most dangerous (Tier 3) sex offenders.

There are two kinds of monitoring-- live time and recorded. The recorded is a map that shows where the person goes over a period of time, so if he is not be be in the vicinity of a school, for example, and the monitor shows him on school grounds yesterday, it can be used to violate his probation or parole. However, it does nothing to prevent anything-- just shows later on.

The other kind is live monitoring. This means that if the guy is supposed to be in his house between 8 pm and 6 am and it shows him going to his girlfriend's house where the victim lives at 3 in the morning, the PO can go out there to bust him.

Problem with the recorded system is that it prevents nothing. Problem with the live version is that there must be POs on duty 24/7 to watch these guys. Cost per PO with proper gear is going to run more than $100,000 per year times how many POs you need to hire. Actual cost is probably more than that.

The state and feds often put out laws/requirements which are not really effective but sound good to the politicians who want to get tough on sex offenders. Raises false hopes for the general public and gets them re-elected. However, they expect the parole or probation departments to absorb the huge costs without supplying the money necessary to carry out a questionable policy.

Add to that the fact that repeat offenders are extremely low and most crimes are caused by people unknown to the system.

It's a lot more complex than most people realize.

Ken


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#203203 - 02/02/08 04:22 PM Re: Online predator [Re: Ken Singer, LCSW]
reality2k4 Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 07/06/04
Posts: 6838
Loc: Stuck between water, air, and ...
Quote:
It's a lot more complex than most people realize.


Of course it is, but there is no preventative measures to stop child abuse, and there never has been.
Imagine! The number of kids suffering what we suffered, with nobody to talk to.

Just a note Ken, there are also female abusers',

dte

_________________________
Whoever stole the Sun, put it back and we'll drop all the charges!

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