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#19742 - 07/23/05 03:14 PM Re: Stop the Perps NOW--Young people, prosecute!
reality2k4 Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 07/06/04
Posts: 6838
Loc: Stuck between water, air, and ...
All the young guys have issued prosecution against their perps.

One guy did it just yesterday, and it must have been a terrifying experience.

I hope they are all believed, there is a lot of tragedy in each of these cases, because a lot of other hurt gets lashed onto the perps own family.

They have to be purged though, in case they have access to do it again,

ste

_________________________
Whoever stole the Sun, put it back and we'll drop all the charges!

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#19743 - 07/23/05 03:19 PM Re: Stop the Perps NOW--Young people, prosecute!
roadrunner Offline
Administrator Emeritus
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 05/02/05
Posts: 22045
Loc: Carlisle, PA
Jasper,

That is something I think about all the time. It just grieves me beyond words to think how many other kids were hurt because I did not or could not speak up in 1963. My abuser lived on for another 31 years, and I know for certain of one other boy in my Scout troop who was abused by him - we have spoken on the phone about this and he was as cruelly brutalized as I was. So how many others? 2, 5, 10, 20, 100....?

I would not want to lay any kind of guilt trip on the young guys here. We do have to remember that the attitude of the older adults toward this includes a ton of emotional baggage: we would just love to see the teens do what we could not do. But that said, yes, I wonder if they have anything they can tell us.

Brandon, Charlie, Desvelar, GuitarGuy, Kevin, Nyjah, Puppy (and the others who are around): what are your thoughts on this? Don't feel you have to justify or defend anything, but it would be good to hear from you on this if you feel you can talk about it.

I think I know one thing that is going to come out of any discussion. The structure we have now for dealing with this kind of thing isn't "teen-friendly". And I bet any of the boys or young men with us here is looking at the option of prosecution with very sceptical eyes after the fiasco of the Michael Jackson case.

So again: Brandon, Charlie, Desvelar, GuitarGuy, Kevin, Nyjah, Puppy (and the others): Do you think it is a good idea to try to prosecute your abusers, or does it look like a bad deal from the very beginning? Tell us what you think.

Larry

_________________________
Nobody living can ever stop me
As I go walking my freedom highway.
Nobody living can make me turn back:
This land was made for you and me.
(Woody Guthrie)

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#19746 - 07/23/05 03:49 PM Re: Stop the Perps NOW--Young people, prosecute!
dwf Offline
Moderator/BoD Emeritus
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 05/24/03
Posts: 1223
Loc: Austin, Texas USA
Jasper,

I feel like I understand where you are coming from.

But I think that demanding that others take specific actions that might or might not be helpful to their specific situations might not be helpful.

I would encourage you and others to consider perhaps if we are encouraging todays young people to pursue specific courses of action as a way of making up for our own perceived lack of initiative when we were younger.

If you can see the possiblity of that happening, then I'm sure you will agree that it is unfair to ask this generation to take on and carry our baggage. They have their own to deal with and do need encouragement with that, whatever that may be.

I feel certain, from what I know of you, that your heart is in the right place. But placing such a load on the shoulders of anyone, young or old, is not a good way to deal with our own unfulfilled desires.

I certainly hope this doesn't sound like an admonishment or that I am chastising anyone. These feelings of wanting to help others are wonderful and represents the best of human nature.

Still none of us like to be told what we should be doing, particularly when we are doing the very best we can.

It may be that prosecution is not the 'next right thing' for some people to do. Maybe learning to love themselves and forgive themselves is what they should be doing. Maybe that's what all of us need to be doing.

There are many people in this world concerned with prosecuting sexual predators. Many professionals work full time at doing this.

There is only one of each of us to work on the healing inside of ourselves that must be done. No one else can do this work. We are the only ones, who, with help, can begin the difficult work of recovering from the effects of sexual abuse.

As I progress in my recovery, and sometimes it seems like pitiful progress, I then have something of real value to offer to other survivors--hope.

Don't get me wrong. I'm all for prosecuting perpetrators of sexual abuse. But I don't imagine that it is the primary goal of the survivor of sexual abuse. It is, in my opinion, once again, the obsession with the predator taking precedence over the real, desperate need that each survivor has to learn to love, accept and heal himself.

Yes, encourage those who are at the 'prosecuting' stage of their recovery to continue with that course of action if that is what feels right for them.

But let's not give anyone the impression that our recovery and our healing is in ANY way dependent upon what may or may not happen to the perpetrator.

That way lies despair and madness, because we are once again giving power to the sexual abuser.

There is another dimension to this discussion that has to do with the dynamics of the relationship between older men and younger survivors; but I'll save that for later.

Jasper, your heart seems to be as big as Texas, and your enthusiasm is contagious.

Thanks for being such an active and loving member of the Male Survivor DB.

Regards,

_________________________
"Poke salad Annie, 'gators got you granny
Everybody said it was a shame
'Cause her mama was aworkin' on the chain-gang"

-Tony Joe White

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#19748 - 07/23/05 04:26 PM Re: Stop the Perps NOW--Young people, prosecute!
roadrunner Offline
Administrator Emeritus
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 05/02/05
Posts: 22045
Loc: Carlisle, PA
Wow! Look what has happened to this thread in less than an hour.

Jasper, there was nothing wrong with your thoughts on this issue, and I do hope some of the younger guys will join in.

I had some thoughts on your comments about poetry Jasper, but I will put that in a different thread.

Can I stress, just generally speaking and not aiming at anyone in particular, that this cannot turn into an argument? If we ask the boys to speak up, they have to know in advance that their feelings will not be invalidated or their sentiments raked over and queried. I think we all remember what happened a month ago when the boys were asked what they thought on an important issue, and then got abused, humiliated and shot down one by one.

What we need to do is listen and understand, not tell them to do what we, for whatever good reasons, didn't do however many years ago. This really does need to be about hugs all around (idea from Jasper of course) \:\) .

All the best,
Larry

_________________________
Nobody living can ever stop me
As I go walking my freedom highway.
Nobody living can make me turn back:
This land was made for you and me.
(Woody Guthrie)

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#19750 - 07/23/05 05:09 PM Re: Stop the Perps NOW--Young people, prosecute!
demonboi Offline
Member

Registered: 05/14/05
Posts: 228
Loc: East Coast


_________________________
Every corner, every city
There's a place where life's a little easy
Little Hennessy, laid back and cool
Every hour, cause it's all good
Leave all the stress from the world outside
Every wrong done will be alright
Nothin but peace, love
And street passion, every ghetto needs a thug mansion

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#19751 - 07/23/05 05:42 PM Re: Stop the Perps NOW--Young people, prosecute!
desvelar Offline
Member

Registered: 06/13/05
Posts: 55
Loc: The Wired
Hey all it Desvelar
I personally do not want to prosecute I am to scared and my parents would find out and I dont know
I dont want to think about it much I mean I would love to see my perp go to jail but I could handle it. It would probably kill whats left on the inside of me which is pretty much empty. Also that legal system area thing would help. I will add more4 later I just cant write anymore for now its to hard becuase to many memories are coming up.


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#19752 - 07/23/05 07:18 PM Re: Stop the Perps NOW--Young people, prosecute!
Kirk Wayne Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 05/31/05
Posts: 499
Loc: Shrewsbury UK
***Could prove TRIGGERING*******************

Hi

It effects different people in lots of different ways. The thought once terrified me, but it came to the point of discloser because it was either that, go insane or try to commit su*c*de for the fourth time. I am four and a half years from my disclosing, two of my perps were convicted and one served only half his sentance the other got a 250 fine. A third abuser is now in custody awaiting committal for trial (which will happen next week). Only you and you alone can choose but make sure you are aware of ALL the possible pitfalls, I never got to give evidence in the two trials although I was called (and was the whistle blower to these perps activities) and that was a big disappointment as I wanted to tell the world what these two (three/four) perps had done to me, but that is typical of our criminal justice system here in the UK. I'm still waiting to tell the world.

I disclosed and prosecuted as I had knowhere else to run to as I had run out of places to hide. I had to face it full on and four and a bit years down the line I'm sure glad I did.

I have done some rough calculations for one of my perps when he was ab*sing me he would have at least three boys visit him (or he would pick them up) daily and he was definately active before meeting me, that was in 1970 taking out time spent in prison he would have commited thousands of offences. These people need to be stopped. Unfortunately the authorities will not allow us to throw away the keys.

By my calculations three boys a day over a period of thiry four years is a total of 37,230. Taking account of those that didnt play ball say 50% thats 18,615 survivors

Kirk.
"Instigate change, as it appears it wont come naturally in our cause. Sometimes it needs a little forcing".


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#19753 - 07/23/05 07:24 PM Re: Stop the Perps NOW--Young people, prosecute!
puppy Offline
Member

Registered: 05/28/05
Posts: 129
Loc: earth
reading this post made me feel sick. no offense intended to anyone, but i have to share my feelings on this. i think its totally noble to want every young person to go after his abuser etc etc etc.

on the other hand, im a young person. and yes i have the power to make sure my abuser gets charged and everything. HOWEVER. its much easier to SAY it after the fact when you no longer have th power to do it, than it is to DO IT. i have lost SO many nights of sleep and convinced myself i am just as bad as him, because i dont have the balls to do something about it. yes other kids are being abused. hes doing it to other kids. he has to be. people like that dont just stop.

WHY IS IT MY RESPONSIBILITY.

i know it has to be someones. but some of us just are not strong enough to do that. a whole life of being treated like an animal and a sex object has brought me here, to this website, the only place i really truly feel like im understood. and even here there are some things i just cant talk about. because its too damn hard and it hurts too much. even with my therapist there are subjects i just cant bring up and memories i just cant talk about. its taking every tiny bit of strength i have in me to just keep going forward and try to put myself back together. and there is NO WAY IN HELL i could pick up a phone and call a lawyer or the police and tell a complete stranger the most traumatic, disgusting, humiliating, painful things that i keep buried inside me. and then what. go to court? and tell MORE people? and have to face him? sorry. call me weak. call me a total insensitive jerk for not being selfless enough to protect other kids. yes i care. more than i could ever explain. i hate myself every second because im so damn weak. and i hate myself for all the kids who are being hurt and it might as well be my fault.

but some of us just arent that strong. and im one of them. i could do it. but that would leave me with only one option and its not a good one.

i understand completely why people think us young guys should take acton and save the world. but im not a hero. im just a guy trying to survive.

_________________________
pUpPy

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#19754 - 07/23/05 07:36 PM Re: Stop the Perps NOW--Young people, prosecute!
EGL Offline
Moderator Emeritus
MaleSurvivor
Registered: 06/19/04
Posts: 7821
As I've told my therapist several times, I have no inclination to rehabilitate my perp brother. He may be abusing others still, and it wouldn't surprise me if he is. But I don't see it as my obligation to further the trauma upon myself by trying to save the rest of the world from him. As Puppy said above, maybe I just don't have the balls for it, and that could very well be true. Self preservation and recovery is what I'm most interested in at this point, not falling into those same old patterns of the past where I feel like I have to please everyone and sacrifice myself for them in the process. I'm not going to do it, and I think no one else should be expected to have to extend their trauma further than it already has been done to them unless they feel especially led to do so.

And if someone told me that I should feel obligated to warn others about his character and that I had a duty to do it, I'd tell them to experience what I have, learn what living in my head is like, and then don't try to lay those guilt trips on me because I haven't the desire to prolong that aspect of this horrible thing.

_________________________
Eddie

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#19757 - 07/23/05 07:54 PM Re: Stop the Perps NOW--Young people, prosecute!
reality2k4 Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 07/06/04
Posts: 6838
Loc: Stuck between water, air, and ...
Wow, did I see this coming, that is why I asked Jasper to put the trigger warning up.

It is a very contentious issue, and I could see why it would be.

I can still remember the hurt as a kid, wanting him caught, not wanting him caught, and the thing is, I reported it, and he never got caught as far as I remember.

The feelings of guilt, and what if he is caught, and what will happen, and will they believe him, because he is a grown up etc etc etc.

You fell guilty whichever way it goes, caught or not, it is your guilt and they just seem to walk away and ruin your life and not theirs.

If I had to go to court and he was found not guilty, then my mind would have been destroyed, and I dont suppose I would be here, but in some mental institution.

It is not your fault, it is not your guilt, it is not your shame and humiliation, it is theirs, but we cannot even give it to them, even if they are convicted, but we do have the peace of mind, that they are no longer free to do it to others.

ste

_________________________
Whoever stole the Sun, put it back and we'll drop all the charges!

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#19759 - 07/23/05 08:22 PM Re: Stop the Perps NOW--Young people, prosecute!
Soccer Kid Offline
Member

Registered: 10/22/04
Posts: 273
Loc: Missouri
Jasper,

I'm no longer young enough to pursue any of my perpetrators.

I would like to comment a bit on this topic however and offer my 2 cents worth.

I have 7 different perps in my life...6 were sexual and physical one was just physical. My mother knows about 2 of them, possibly 3. She never took it to trial. I wish she did.

I think that puppy nailed it on the head in his post. It's hard to want to face the person who did it to you. But one thing I can promise is that in the future, when you have healed a bit more, you will wish you had taken them to court.

Puppy is older than the others here from what I gather, he's still younger than me, but not by much. Kevin, Charlie, GuitarGuy et al, are younger. There is a great deal of weight being placed on their parents to make the decision. I often wonder if any of these people live in states like California where victims are compelled to testify in sexual abuse alligations?

Puppy asked a very important question. Why is it his responsibility? Puppy...it's not. But there is a chain going on puppy that you are sadly just another link in, and you seem to be a strong link. The child abused after you, before you and before them and after them all say the same thing: "why is it my responsibility?" That's why the abuse continues.

I'm not going to try to convince anyone to prosecute...but I will say this: for once it's a good idea to be a weak link in the chain. They need to be stopped. If you don't do it, and if no one else does it...they will go unpunished.

"To sin by silence when we should protest makes cowards of men" is a famous quote that I love. Sometimes protesting and standing up is hard, and sometimes it's impossible. But someone has to do it.

_________________________
~Zach~
Deviant of Many Talents

"Reality is just an illusion."

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#19760 - 07/23/05 08:28 PM Re: Stop the Perps NOW--Young people, prosecute!
Kirk Wayne Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 05/31/05
Posts: 499
Loc: Shrewsbury UK
Puppy

"i have lost SO many nights of sleep and convinced myself i am just as bad as him, because i dont have the balls to do something about it. yes other kids are being abused. hes doing it to other kids. he has to be. people like that dont just stop".

This is exactly what happened to me aged 44 but then again I had smothered those memories with the aid of alcohol/drugs for nearly thirty five years.

"but some of us just are not strong enough to do that".

Not at this precise moment in time I suspect most of us have had that thought. Speaking purely for myself I found it easier to talk to a complete stranger as they were not aware of all the emotional baggage that I hauled around with me and they couldnt be judgemental of me as they didnt know me before disclosing.

Puppy you say you are weak, I am afraid I am going to have to disagree, it takes incredable bravery to say the things you have and to admit to feeling weak ... I would say that takes a lot of guts for waht we have all been through no one could ever call us weak, we are survivors and we have endured a lot more than most people could ever take (or ever imagine).

Best wishes

Kirk
"Instigate change, as it appears it wont come naturally in our cause. Sometimes it needs a little forcing".


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#19761 - 07/23/05 08:31 PM Re: Stop the Perps NOW--Young people, prosecute!
reality2k4 Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 07/06/04
Posts: 6838
Loc: Stuck between water, air, and ...
Hi Jasper, yeah, abuse is a dilemma whichever way up or down it is, I lived in fear from 10yo onwards of him coming to kill me and stuff.

No you are not to blame for all the other boys that came after you, but you sure feel like it at the time, I did, it raked me through Hell.

When I was just the little kid, I eyeballed every male who was in my space, and viewed them with suspicion, and I suppose that is one of the magnetic signs for other perps to seek me.

And dont forget it was OK for an adult to slap a kid who they didnt feel was OK with them, and I got a few knocks off adults, for being suspicious of them, and that made my mind feel that they too were perps.

If I look at the young guys in here, then I have found one thing in common, transparency.

A young guy can feel quite alone and alienated, because people who are much older find that they cannot reach out, because of their young age.

I find that I have to reach out regardless of age or whatever else, because it is my paternal instinct to do so, but in the process, they teach me so many things that I had long forgotten.

It taught me how beautiful a boys mind can be, and how creative they can be, something I lost down the line, but now I may be able to rescue some of it by listening to them.

I dont give them advice, but I can help them through some of their fears and feelings, and even if it hurts me to listen, I dont mind if I am helping them through.

ste

_________________________
Whoever stole the Sun, put it back and we'll drop all the charges!

Top
#19762 - 07/23/05 08:41 PM Re: Stop the Perps NOW--Young people, prosecute!
puppy Offline
Member

Registered: 05/28/05
Posts: 129
Loc: earth
the whole idea of prosecuting him just seems like something in a movie. something that other people do. butnot me. im pretty damn sure that no one would listen or believe anything i had to say anyway. really, how can i prove it. i cant. yes my whole family knows, but none of them have done anything. and none of them seem all that concerned wtih my mental anguish anyway. would they support me? no. my mom let it happen. and she knew and still called me a liar to my face. we have talked about it several times. i know there is no way shed support me. my brother and sister would probably not support me either. my sister lives in her own reality. she wasnt abused by him so hes the greatest dad ever. they have a wonderful relationship. because he only likes little boys. theres a hallmark card in there someonwhere.

my brother went through it all too. and if we had a relationship maybe id ask him how he feels about it. but we dont. so i cant.

no one believes kids who dont have proof. and im not a kid anymore. no one would listen.

if there was a way of prosecuting him without having to see him or talk about it, id do it. if i could make some anonymous phone call and know hed be put in jail or shot, id do it. but i cant. and there is no guarantee that, if i did go through the whole process and tell my sickest secrets to a million strangers, that he would be convicted.

and part of my not wanting to do it is that i dont want to know the value of all my suffering. what ws it worth. ten years of being raped. what is that in prison time? a few months? probation? what am i worth. not much, legally, im sure. if i stumbled upon enough courage to do it and he got some sort of probation, or a few months in jail, or a year, how am i supposed to feel about that. it would destroy me.

and then everyone knows. i grew up in a small town. so suddenly im the boy who is causing all this crap, and for what. so my dad can spend a couple months in jail. and then i can walk around for the rest of my life with a tshirt saying 'my dad raped me' because everyone will already know anyway. and when i go to the store to buy some gum they can all stre and talk about me and my family and is he lying? did you hear the things he said about his father? and they can all hide their children from me because i might end up just like him.

sure maybe it wouldnt be that bad. but maybe it would. there are so many possibilities. and i cant face them. i know i should. morally. for all the little boys i see in malls and parks, just being kids and playing, for all of those kids i should tell someone. because they might be next. or it might have already happened.

so i have all these feelings. and what am i supposed to do with them. im screwed if i do, im screwed if i dont.

_________________________
pUpPy

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#19763 - 07/23/05 08:46 PM Re: Stop the Perps NOW--Young people, prosecute!
Soccer Kid Offline
Member

Registered: 10/22/04
Posts: 273
Loc: Missouri
Puppy,

You do what is best for you. That's the best advice. Go after him, don't go after him. You have to focus on yourself right now.

_________________________
~Zach~
Deviant of Many Talents

"Reality is just an illusion."

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#19764 - 07/23/05 08:58 PM Re: Stop the Perps NOW--Young people, prosecute!
Leosha Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 06/18/03
Posts: 3614
Loc: Right here
I appreciate the enthusiasm and want for justice that prompted this thread. I wish to also say it can put a LOT of pressure on people to so strongly 'suggest' they prosecute.

(Parts of this below may be trigger.)

I have been pushed to do legal action by someone here. I am not a 'youngster' I suppose, I am in my 20s. My two friends from the same country who post here are 19 and 26. Any of us are still in the age in our country where we could attempt to prosecute. A person needs to be READY to take such action. Being young enough to do it does not constitute 'ready'.

Certain circumstances last year pushed me into making a police statement against my main sexual offender. As did another friend who posts here, and another person who does not. Three people 'coming forward' in about a week with complaints against the same man. Should have prompted investigation, yes? And reportedly it did. None of us heard nothing, although at one point I was told by someone I know they had been asked about his knowledge of this man. It gave me positive feelings for whatever the outcome would be. But at the same time, I was not at all ready for this, and the emotional repercussions of the action, and it pushed me back emotionally for several months. I continually had fears and panick of this becoming public, of people knowing this about me (and yes, I know it is not my shame and all that; but I am someone who has want and need for privacy, and this would have quite killed that). Oh, and after six months, when I was in my home country again, they said they could not 'discuss an ongoing investigation'. Earlier this year, when my friend was back in our home country again, he asked about it, and the answer was basically 'um, what? What are you talking about?' Apparantly the 'investigation' has been rather misplaced. As the same thing can still at times happen to people in our country, we remain rather quiet of it right now.

I have three people who sexually abused me, outside of my parents. My one friend here, there were four who abused him (one is since passed away). My other friend here, again, several. It is quite hard to imagine trying to go through the stresses of making reports against all those people, and perhaps, as with our first effort, have it turn out as nothing.

(Another case with bigger triggers below. Details shared with permission of those involved.)

My two other friends who post here, they shared one abuser in commen, simply in coincidence. For one it was a one-time issue, for the other it occurred over many years. This man, after engaging in some stalking behavior, finally had first one, then both of these people make statements against him based on his past activities. He will be in court on trial in September. Not for child abuse. For murdering three teenage boys (three that can be proven) and keeping 'souvenirs' of them. Both of these people have been asked to testify in court, to attest to the violence and torture that this man most likely inflicted on these boys. At least one of them will have to. Both are terrified, and again, very concerned of very private issues becoming public before either is ready.

Yes, it is a powerful thing that the younger members here, even up to possibly age 30 in some cases, have the element of pressing charges at their advantage. However, the power to do that is taken away when you are pressured to act when you are not ready to do it safely. The person who tried to push me to do this before I was ready, he is a good, decent man, one I call friend here. But our friendship was almost lost due to the pressure I felt was being put on me, until we were able to talk about it.

For those who are older here, or whose perpetrators are dead now perhaps, who feel they missed their chance to take legal action, I am sure it is a wonderful thing to think the children and other younger members here still DO have that chance. And it is perhaps hard to not want them to do it. But it must be THEIR choice, when THEY are ready. No one here can heal vicariously through another. If every child, young adult, every person here under age 30 was to prosecute every one of their abusers, child sexual abuse of both boys and girls will still happen. Public executions did not stop crime. Legal consequences do not stop crime. I fear it is dangerous to (maybe unconsciously) wish to use younger victims of this crime to 'stop' these things from happening. It will not stop it, it may make a statement, but whatever words the action speaks, they must be those prepared to be dealt with by the person.

I'm sorry to go on so long here, but the issue greatly triggered my emotions and personal (very) strong feelings, as you can see. I guess the whole of what I am trying to say is please do not harm those already victimized by adding pressure and expectations on their healing.

Leosha

_________________________
Avatar photo in memory of my younger brother Makar.

"Human salvation lies in the hands of the creatively maladjusted."~~~Martin Luther King Jr., 1963

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#19766 - 07/23/05 09:28 PM Re: Stop the Perps NOW--Young people, prosecute!
guitarguy Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 07/11/05
Posts: 12
Loc: Canada
Im twenty, and i was abused at five. I think a lot about what happened, and what I want to do about it.

Now, some might not agree with this, but here it is: I moved away from my home town 10 years later, and my parents are moving back in a year or two. The police I have spoken to say that I have to go to my hometown police to report this, so Im gonna wait. In the 9 months since remembering what happened, the details have slowly come back to me. If i go to the cops I want to be able to go through it all without breaking down again.

The one thing Im not sure about is whether or not Ill go to court. I am being treated for schizophrenia, and my shrink seems to think it would be too stressful for me to face a defence lawyer(the reason why schizophrenics sometimes hear voices is because of stress).

I dunno, everyone seems to go about it their own way. Maybe us younger survivors should take our time. If we KNOW that our abuser is continuing to go after kids then we should think about action.

Times they are a'changin, lets see where the future takes us.

_________________________
how are you?

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#19768 - 07/23/05 09:39 PM Re: Stop the Perps NOW--Young people, prosecute!
puppy Offline
Member

Registered: 05/28/05
Posts: 129
Loc: earth
dont wait too long unless youre sure of the statute of limitations.

_________________________
pUpPy

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#19769 - 07/23/05 09:47 PM Re: Stop the Perps NOW--Young people, prosecute!
reality2k4 Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 07/06/04
Posts: 6838
Loc: Stuck between water, air, and ...
This thread is sure picking up momentum, and I suppose it would do.

We all sing from the same hymn book here, that perps should be prosecuted and jailed.

Police are not helpful, they are intimidating to kids, how could they not be?

Kids are not like adults, they have a lot of fears instilled in them, that says tone down the event.

I remember when it happened to me, and all I wanted to do was to bath this filth off my body.

My father was absolutely ballistic, so we went straight to the police station, and they make me look at pictures, and I think, whoa, how many of them are out there!

I could not go through those photographs and it possibly gave me more nightmares to look at them, but I thought as a child, that thousands of these beasts were in the area where I lived, but dont forget I was only a kid.

I toned down the statement to the police to protect my fathers feelings, and that too is a guilt trip.

My father was only there as part of the interview, but I thought that if I told the truth he would get to know what really happened.

Perps know that most boys will just live in silence, because they are manipulative of them, and their age is always against them, I wish I could be their advocate, and I sure hope other young guys get the justice they deserve.

The analogy is always this, an abused boy or girl, will live a life sentence in their own prison, the perp might get a few years for what they get caught for, but how many lives have they taken before they get caught.

Therapy is cool, but you have to beg for it, or at least in my country, it is not offered at source, and how many abused kids seek it for fear of being classed at mentally unstable!

I remember my dad saying that I have to see a psychiatrist, wow, that is really cool to a kid, when it was not his fault, but the problems that arose from my own abuse made me a freak in my own family.

OK daddy, you think I am mad, and you think I need a shrink, and at such a young age I thought, whoa, why is it all my fault.

No wonder I ran away so much, and hid from everyone, and I only got to know me since I came here, and found that I am not so mad after all.

ste

_________________________
Whoever stole the Sun, put it back and we'll drop all the charges!

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#19770 - 07/23/05 10:32 PM Re: Stop the Perps NOW--Young people, prosecute!
Lloydy Offline
Administrator Emeritus
MaleSurvivor
Registered: 04/17/02
Posts: 7071
Loc: England Shropshire
This is a delicate subject, and one that will surely bring forth very mixed views.

I'm 52yo and have never seriously entertained bringing prosecutions against any of my abusers.
The oldest, the teacher, is probably dead by now. And the two ringleader older boys are about 54 - 55 yo now.
I only disclosed in 1999 and the abuse ended in 1968, so the statute of limitations was up anyway.

But I doubt very much that I would have gone to the law anyway.
I feared the stress involved much more than the possible result, I'd seen perp's walking when cases collapsed from 'lack of evidence'. How much evidence can we provide years down the line? none, it's a flat out argument between lawyers, and we've seen what expensive lawyers can do haven't we?

But I do feel bad that I know both of the older boys were / are still sexually active in dubious ways. I live in the area I grew up in as they still do, and I now have good contacts to find out such things.
Would that knowledge have made much difference to my choice to stay silent? none at all - however hard that sounds.

I made my choice on purely selfish grounds, I came first, and I still do.
If I have any 'efforts' spare then I do use them for others, which is why I find myself here and at Axis helping survivors in any way I can, but it's NEVER at my expense.

And I refuse to allow myself to guilty or weak for not chasing them through our legal system.

Dave

_________________________
Go confidently in the direction of your dreams! Live the life you've imagined. As you simplify your life, the laws of the universe will be simpler.
Henry David Thoreau

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#19771 - 07/23/05 10:52 PM Re: Stop the Perps NOW--Young people, prosecute!
Soccer Kid Offline
Member

Registered: 10/22/04
Posts: 273
Loc: Missouri
I took the liberty to compile a list of statutes of limitations for criminal cases (only) involving the sexual abuse of children.

You might be surprised that even though your 40 you can still prosecute!

Disclaimer: This is NOT legal advice! Consult a licensed attorney in your state for accurate information.

Definitions:
-Statute of limitations: a certain amount of time set by law that a person has to bring civil and/or criminal cases to justice. When they "expire" no cases can be brought forth.
-Tolling: allowing "extra" time for children victims of crime

Note: Some states have exceptions to the following laws. Depending on your specific situation you may fall under these exceptions. If you have questions, corrections or want help finding an attorney in your state let me know and I will be glad to help you.

If anyone is interested in civil statutes let me know and I can post them too \:\)

ALABAMA
none

ALASKA
1st or 2nd degree - none | 3rd - 10 years

ARIZONA
7 years

ARKANSAS
6 years

CALIFORNIA
aggrivated - none | non-agrivated 6 years

COLORADO
10 years

CONNECTICUT
5 years

DELAWARE
1st degree - none | lesser degree - 5 years

DC
6 years

FLORIDA
1st degree - 4 years

GEORGIA
15 years

HAWAII
1st degree - 6 years | 2nd & 3rd - 3 years

IDAHO
none

ILLINOIS
10 years (note: must have reported offense to law enforcement within 2 years of commission of offense)

INDIANA
Class A - none | Class B - 5 years

IOWA
1st, 2nd & 3rd - 10 years

KANSAS
5 years

KENTUCKY
none

LOUISIANA
agrivated - none | forcible - 10 years | simple - 4 years

MAINE
6 years

MARYLAND
none

MASSACHUSETTS
15 years

MICHIGAN
6 years

MINNESOTA
9 years (note: if victim fails to report offense within limitation period, prosecution must start within 3 years of reporting offense.)

MISSISSIPPI
none | sexual battery - 2 years

MISSOURI
none | sexual assault - 3 years

MONTANA
10 years

NEBRASKA
7 years

NEVADA
4 years (note: there is no limitation if offense is reported to law enforcement within the 4 year period.)

NEW HAMPSHIRE
6 years

NEW JERSEY
sexual assault - none | aggrivated sexual conduct - 5 years

NEW MEXICO
1st - none | 2nd - 6 years | 3rd & 4th - 5 years

NEW YORK
5 years

NORTH CAROLINA
none

NORTH DAKOTA
3 years

OHIO
20 years

OKLAHOMA
7 years

OREGON
6 years

PENNSYLVANIA
5 years

RHODE ISLAND
1st - none | lesser - 3 years

SOUTH CAROLINA
none

SOUTH DAKOTA
7 years

TENNESSEE
aggrivated - 15 years | 8 years | sexual battery - 2 years

TEXAS
7 years

UTAH
4 years

VERMONT
aggrivated - none | 6 years

VIRGINIA
none

WASHINGTON
10 years (note: must be reported to law enforcement within 1 year)

WEST VIRGINIA
none

WISCONSIN
6 years

WYOMING
none

_________________________
~Zach~
Deviant of Many Talents

"Reality is just an illusion."

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#19773 - 07/23/05 11:00 PM Re: Stop the Perps NOW--Young people, prosecute!
VN Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 06/03/05
Posts: 723
I - not the young man, I - age of 26 years. I shall speak in court that one person do to me soon. I find now when yes, to speak, it should find our own power again.

But it is the most fair, I speak, that I am rather afraid to make it. I - with the obligation, I have told, that I shall be, which - all certainly. But I am afraid of it very much. I am afraid of effects which it will have on my life, and I know, that there will be the some people. I am not afraid of that happens with that man. That man, he is rather malicious and broken, and his life, I think finished when all over again he choose to harm to children. I have no anxiety for him. But for me. He will go to prison, it is possible for a life, possible he will receive the offer to die. But again, what from me? I shall be the set questions of me directly, my own behavior and actions. This man, he selects me because me then I am 15 years age, living alone and doing sexual things for money. It - not actions, which I wish my friends and familiars to know about me. It - not things which I wish that my sister knew about me. And still, after that, they will be. How my life will change from this? How people will think different of me? He is least important from problems. It is of great importance to me, that he really goes to prison. But I do not know, that I only would like to oppose him if it had my own choice of time. And as I speak, I - not the child, I am the adult. All this still - the reason of fear to me. I know, that I have some friends, very close who will support me with it. I am mainly confident, that my sister will be. Who - or in my life or in the world, I have no ideas, that they will think, and it frightens me.

It can be power. It can be also fear. I think right now for me, it - both.

VN


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#19775 - 07/23/05 11:25 PM Re: Stop the Perps NOW--Young people, prosecute!
demonboi Offline
Member

Registered: 05/14/05
Posts: 228
Loc: East Coast
I coulnd't do it, I don't want to. I'm just being honest. My stomach hurts and I cry, I can't do it. I cant' even think about it, brings up too much stuff.

_________________________
Every corner, every city
There's a place where life's a little easy
Little Hennessy, laid back and cool
Every hour, cause it's all good
Leave all the stress from the world outside
Every wrong done will be alright
Nothin but peace, love
And street passion, every ghetto needs a thug mansion

Top
#19776 - 07/23/05 11:29 PM Re: Stop the Perps NOW--Young people, prosecute!
reality2k4 Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 07/06/04
Posts: 6838
Loc: Stuck between water, air, and ...
Jasper, I cannot voice my true opinion here, because I was so young and innocent when this happened to me, and I lost all thought of rational thinking.

Not being able to think rationally as an adult, can be such a disabling condition, and It can mean that I can possibly be misunderstood as I was as a child.

When a child is abused, he tries to make sense of the hurt, he tries to make sense of why he was hurt, he tries to make sense of everything around him, and how his life and normal relationships can ever be the same as his peers.

He becomes detached from society even if it is only subtle, but he detaches from his normal approach to growing up and 'thriving' in society with all of this emotional baggage.

He learns to survive even though he carries the weight of his past, and his past can be a massive weight to carry, when he realises all of the normal relationships he should have been able to achieve, but were smashed through abuse.

An abused boy will ALWAYS BLAME HIMSELF, how could he not do!

When I was a kid, I just had to be away from everybody, cos, I got dragged around clinics and hospitals, and every doc I saw I thought, Ok, I am gonna tell you what the real trouble is.

I felt like something that can never be fixed, but how can you fix a broken childhood, I dont know if there is an answer, but I dont think there is.

What happened to me was never my fault, and it caused me deep mental trauma, and it made me feel alien in my family, because it made me feel like it was my fault.

I did not get so much support except from my dad.

Maybe I write a real triggering post here, where the kid (Me) felt so vulnerable with no way out.

I have to get through tho, to the other side of feeling that it was my fault, and it is not easy,

ste

_________________________
Whoever stole the Sun, put it back and we'll drop all the charges!

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#19778 - 07/24/05 12:19 AM Re: Stop the Perps NOW--Young people, prosecute!
demonboi Offline
Member

Registered: 05/14/05
Posts: 228
Loc: East Coast
Jasper-I understand. But I just can't do it. Could you bring your abuser to court at 13?

_________________________
Every corner, every city
There's a place where life's a little easy
Little Hennessy, laid back and cool
Every hour, cause it's all good
Leave all the stress from the world outside
Every wrong done will be alright
Nothin but peace, love
And street passion, every ghetto needs a thug mansion

Top
#19782 - 07/24/05 12:31 AM Re: Stop the Perps NOW--Young people, prosecute!
demonboi Offline
Member

Registered: 05/14/05
Posts: 228
Loc: East Coast
Leave my sister out of this. It has nothing to do with her.

_________________________
Every corner, every city
There's a place where life's a little easy
Little Hennessy, laid back and cool
Every hour, cause it's all good
Leave all the stress from the world outside
Every wrong done will be alright
Nothin but peace, love
And street passion, every ghetto needs a thug mansion

Top
#19783 - 07/24/05 12:36 AM Re: Stop the Perps NOW--Young people, prosecute!
Leosha Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 06/18/03
Posts: 3614
Loc: Right here
Quote:
Originally posted by Jasper50:

I just wonder if some other boy might be hurting. Only you know the answer to that question.

But whatever you decide you are not to blame.
These two statements appear to be rather contradictory, and lend some credence to my prior caution of pressuring a young person to do something they are not ready for. There appears to be an essence of trying to 'guilt' someone into acting when they are not in the emotionally stable place to do so. Please be careful in this. Everyone.

Leosha

_________________________
Avatar photo in memory of my younger brother Makar.

"Human salvation lies in the hands of the creatively maladjusted."~~~Martin Luther King Jr., 1963

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#19784 - 07/24/05 12:37 AM Re: Stop the Perps NOW--Young people, prosecute!
demonboi Offline
Member

Registered: 05/14/05
Posts: 228
Loc: East Coast
word to leosha

_________________________
Every corner, every city
There's a place where life's a little easy
Little Hennessy, laid back and cool
Every hour, cause it's all good
Leave all the stress from the world outside
Every wrong done will be alright
Nothin but peace, love
And street passion, every ghetto needs a thug mansion

Top
#19788 - 07/24/05 01:25 AM Re: Stop the Perps NOW--Young people, prosecute!
demonboi Offline
Member

Registered: 05/14/05
Posts: 228
Loc: East Coast
Okay,

I just don't like my family being brought into this cos I'm trying to protect them from it. Like I don't want them dealing with it. We're cool, its okay. Just hit a nerve that you dind't realize was there.

It hurts her a lot that I was in the hospital cos she feels like she should have done something. but what? I didn't tell anyone.

I haven't told trinity all about it, i want to but I don't. I just told her I got hurt and was coming to this site. Showed her a little. She posted a bit about me being in the hosptial like making sure no one was worried about me. It upsets her and I don't want to upset her, I hate it when that happens and the people I love are hurt by it.

Ryan talked to me about pressing charges. He's her boyfriend. I just changed the subject real fast. I didn't want to talk about it. Ry wants me to but Trinity hasn't said anything about it.

_________________________
Every corner, every city
There's a place where life's a little easy
Little Hennessy, laid back and cool
Every hour, cause it's all good
Leave all the stress from the world outside
Every wrong done will be alright
Nothin but peace, love
And street passion, every ghetto needs a thug mansion

Top
#19790 - 07/24/05 01:40 AM Re: Stop the Perps NOW--Young people, prosecute!
Sinking Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 09/26/03
Posts: 577
Loc: Took my ball and went home.
asper - This thread has obviously struck a major chord among us. But it's taking on a life of its own. There seems to be a 'bipartisan' feel to it. The older men here, most specifically you, seem to want to push the issue, seem to want to encourage the younger men, indeed boys, to report their abusers and take on all that comes with that, as if they didn't have enough to deal with already.

It is a good time to remind everyone here of a couple of things.

First off, most everyone here, was abused by someone older than they were at the time. Encouragement to these younger survivors might feel very much like coercion because it is coming from older men. Be careful of that. No one likes to feel that they are being led down a path that they know leads to something negative. Especially with the past we share. You will, hopefully, only get resistance from those who feel that way, especially from the younger survivors here.

Secondly, you are a man of 50 years old, give or take. You are much more emotionally mature than the young men you are addressing. You have had many years to process what happened to you when you were young. You've had the benefit of therapy and your PTSD group and friends you can talk to and Andy by your side and, most importantly, the comfort, for lack of a better word, that you will not have to come face to face with your abuser ever again. Yet somehow you seem to expect, despite your caveats to the contrary, these young men to take on a task too daunting for them to even comprehend.

There is no good answer to this, except for EVERYONE's answer. The masses have spoken, please let it alone. Otherwise, I fear you will put upon these amazing young survivors a burden that is not theirs, to try to protect others from their abusers. That burden belongs solely to the abusers themselves.

I hope we all can take a well deserved breath, realize that the most important thing for any and all of us to do is to take care of ourselves. Heal yourselves.

IT IS NOT YOUR JOB TO TAKE CARE OF ANYONE ELSE!! IT IS NOT YOUR JOB TO REPORT ANYONE FOR ANYTHING!! Our focus needs to be on healing and recovery for ourselves. If we ever feel strong enough to do for others, we will know when that time is and we will act then.
Peace to All - John


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#19792 - 07/24/05 05:01 AM Re: Stop the Perps NOW--Young people, prosecute!
Soccer Kid Offline
Member

Registered: 10/22/04
Posts: 273
Loc: Missouri
Jasper,

You are correct about the mandated reporting. If a child (in the United States) enters a hospital for an operation that is the direct result of abuse or neglect of ANY type, a report MUST be filed. All 50 states require these reports. All reports are required to be investigated.

If any of these children here have been in the hospital for an operation due to their abuse, they will be, if they haven't already, questioned by law enforcement officials about their abuse.

I for one support you Jasper, I think it is silly that you should have to defend yourself against attacks on this one.

While I personally understand the distress that everyone here has undergone, I feel (this i my opinion of course) that everyone, including the children here, has a DUTY to report their abusers to law enforcement. However, I also understand that facing your abuser in court is difficult and may never be possible. But filing an anonymous report, or mailing a letter to the police or sheriff in your county or city giving them a heads up is the least that can be done to help law enforcement officials do their job. Child molesters are criminals, they MUST be stopped. Unfortunately someone has to be hurt before they can be stopped.

I am going to set up a form on my web site and will post the link here. The form can be used to supply your local law enforcement office with any information you want to give anonymously. No one will ever know who you are or where you are, but a report will be filed that is anonymous just to let the police know that X may be a paedophile. As soon as I get it up, I'll let you guys know. I hope you use it.

After doing the little bit of research that I have...I for one know that I fall within the statute of limitations for one of my abusers...I intend to contact a lawyer tonight about it and see what can be done. It's hard, scary and hurts...but it needs to stop.

_________________________
~Zach~
Deviant of Many Talents

"Reality is just an illusion."

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#19793 - 07/24/05 07:17 AM Re: Stop the Perps NOW--Young people, prosecute!
Soccer Kid Offline
Member

Registered: 10/22/04
Posts: 273
Loc: Missouri
As promised:

Here is a link to a tip reporting form. You can fill the form out anonymously if you want, no one will be able to find out who submitted the tip, even if I am served a search warrant for that information, it simply does not exist. I encourage everyone, even if you can't press criminal charges, to fill out and submit the form. It's easy to do and is the next best thing to pressing charges.

( the link has been removed while MS checks that proper legal procedures are being adhered to at this web site.
MS has at this time no affiliation to this site and cannot vouch for anything found there.
Lloydy. )

_________________________
~Zach~
Deviant of Many Talents

"Reality is just an illusion."

Top
#19794 - 07/24/05 09:21 AM Re: Stop the Perps NOW--Young people, prosecute!
Leosha Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 06/18/03
Posts: 3614
Loc: Right here
Zach,

Thank you for that form. It does not serve purpose for me, as my abuse occurred outside of the united States. But it could help a great number of people here.

Leosha

_________________________
Avatar photo in memory of my younger brother Makar.

"Human salvation lies in the hands of the creatively maladjusted."~~~Martin Luther King Jr., 1963

Top
#19796 - 07/24/05 02:11 PM Re: Stop the Perps NOW--Young people, prosecute!
Zipser Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 05/19/05
Posts: 351
Loc: Connecticut
Correction on the earlier post on state statutes of limitations.

For CIVIL actions in CONNECTICUT the statute was amended in 2002 to 30 YEARS (not a typo) past the age of majority. You have until you turn 48 years of age to bring a civil suit for CSA against your perp in my state.

I filed a few weeks before I turned 48. One of the best decisions I ever made. The burden was shifted from me to where it has always belonged, the perp.

Hope this helps.

Zipser

_________________________
"I stand proud that the boy so badly damaged managed to get me this far and I will honor him and myself for being a survivor." - A member

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#19797 - 07/24/05 03:49 PM Re: Stop the Perps NOW--Young people, prosecute!
sabooka Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 05/19/05
Posts: 209
Loc: I would like to know also
Wow what a post.

I am not going to enter into the discussion. I would just like to give my support to everyone. That means Nyjah who does not want to prosecute and to Kev who is. For me you are both brave and doing what you need to do. I could not imagine what it is like for either of you or for anyone else for that matter. I offer you my support and say that what ever you feel is best for you is what is best for you.

A little note to the older guys. Remember that we are not teenagers anymore and we do not know what it is like to be one nowadays. We lived in a different time so be careful looking back and saying what we could have done. We (the older guys) are no longer in that position and do not understand how things have changed.

Again I offer my support to all of you what ever your situation is. I hope together we all become stronger.

Jonathan

_________________________
My happiness is not dependant on other people's misery.

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#19798 - 07/24/05 08:29 PM Re: Stop the Perps NOW--Young people, prosecute!
Don-NY Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 08/06/02
Posts: 546
Loc: Long Island, NY
Jasper,

I have no doubt you have a good heart, and meant well, but I can't help but wonder how this thread would have proceeded if it had been made by one of our younger members and it read something like this.

How would you have answered such a post?
Quote:

Stop the Perps NOW--Older people, Advocate!

Maybe I've been really dumb. But it occurred to me just a short while ago that there are older people here who have it within their power to keep more young people from getting hurt.

It's too late for us. We already got hurt, maybe by one of the same people who hurt you. Imagine that for a second. The person who hurt you, the one you never reported hurt one of us.

So now that you're older and not the perp's type anymore, now that you're an adult and have all the privledges and freedoms that we younger people don't have, what are you doing to keep us safe?

Sorry, not us - it's too late for us. But according to the 2000 census, there were 32,919,334 males in the USA under age 16 five years ago. So if it's really one in six, that means there are 5,486,556 new victims since 2000. Wait make that 5,486,555, cause Dylan Groene got murdered after that guy was done with him.

Are you writing letters to the newspapers? Are you writing to your congressmen and senators and the Justice Department and District Attorneys and anyone else you can think of? Do you give money or time to organizations that are helping and trying to put an end to this? Do you do anything in your local community to make sure that the kids around you, the kids you see every day are safe?

What are you doing? You were not safe, and you got hurt. You didn't speak out, and how many years later was it before we were not safe and we got hurt?

I'm pretty sure there are people here in their teens, twenties, thirties, forties, fifties, sixties, and seventies. And the beat goes on. There must be doctors, lawyers, businessmen, truckers, cooks, maybe even a politician.

So now, I get to join this club too. Thanks a lot! Sorry if I sound bitter, but I'm just a kid. I can't vote, I can't drive, I can't work full time, I can't do half the stuff adults can do.

SO WHY DON'T YOU DO SOMETHING ABOUT THIS? IF IT'S REALLY ONE IN SIX WHO GETS HURT, IT MUST BE ONLY ONE IN THOUSANDS WHO HAS PROBLEMS WITH IT OR THINKS IT REALLY BAD, HUH?

And then they don't want to talk about it anyway. I guess I understand that. I guess I'll be the same way when I grow up. Maybe it will go away by itself. Or maybe some important politicians kid or billionaires kid will get hurt and then something will be done.

Maybe I'll just stay in Gaboogistan forever, cause NOBODY GETS HURT THERE.

A nation's (people's, SPECIES) greatness is measured by how it treats its weakest members. ~ Mahatma Ghandi
We have met the enemy, and he is us. - Walt Kelly (from Pogo)

_________________________
If you understand everything, some things are just as they are. If you understand nothing, things are still just as they are.

Top
#19799 - 07/24/05 08:57 PM Re: Stop the Perps NOW--Young people, prosecute!
reality2k4 Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 07/06/04
Posts: 6838
Loc: Stuck between water, air, and ...
Don, I have wrote to the national press, I have emailed TV channels who specify in these things, and I got no reply at all.

I asked one guy to run an awareness article in his newspaper with links to MS and other sites, I also offered to write it, no response, but it wont stop me exploring other avenues.

I asked another prominent paper read by the teaching profession to run an article specifically aimed at teachers, and got no response.

I think we all need to do our own little bit, because someone will come up with an ear that listens to such a worthy cause.

It is in the public interest, and the public are unaware of the reality of abuse, and how deep it really goes, but maybe they do not want to take that chance,

I will carry on,

ste

_________________________
Whoever stole the Sun, put it back and we'll drop all the charges!

Top
#19801 - 07/24/05 10:15 PM Re: Stop the Perps NOW--Young people, prosecute!
Soccer Kid Offline
Member

Registered: 10/22/04
Posts: 273
Loc: Missouri
Quote:
Originally posted by Zipser:
Correction on the earlier post on state statutes of limitations.

For CIVIL actions in CONNECTICUT the statute was amended in 2002 to 30 YEARS (not a typo) past the age of majority. You have until you turn 48 years of age to bring a civil suit for CSA against your perp in my state.
Zipser,

This wouldn't be considered a "correction" but an addendum. The limitations that I posted were not civil, they were criminal.

_________________________
~Zach~
Deviant of Many Talents

"Reality is just an illusion."

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#19803 - 07/24/05 10:20 PM Re: Stop the Perps NOW--Young people, prosecute!
Soccer Kid Offline
Member

Registered: 10/22/04
Posts: 273
Loc: Missouri
Don,

I have done just about everything you listed in your post. In addition to that I have started my OWN organization that is very similar to MS and is starting to become a success in a very short period of time.

_________________________
~Zach~
Deviant of Many Talents

"Reality is just an illusion."

Top
#19804 - 07/24/05 10:28 PM Re: Stop the Perps NOW--Young people, prosecute!
Zipser Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 05/19/05
Posts: 351
Loc: Connecticut
SK,

Addendum it is.

Zipser

Does the JD in JDS mean you're an attorney?

_________________________
"I stand proud that the boy so badly damaged managed to get me this far and I will honor him and myself for being a survivor." - A member

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#19805 - 07/24/05 10:31 PM Re: Stop the Perps NOW--Young people, prosecute!
reality2k4 Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 07/06/04
Posts: 6838
Loc: Stuck between water, air, and ...
This is a lousy issue, it is such a personal issue to anyone involved in this stuff.

Please do not turn it into personal argument or hurt for others.

When these threads get so long, it is easy to get lost in the main part of the post, because we all have differing ideas.

I think that we need to think that, anyone who is young here, and is seeking litigation in the courts has had the strength to do it.

It is massive step for a young guy to take, there are so many issued involved, and a whole load of spinoff issues, it can be hard.

It can be like, OK I did it, I feel good, then I feel real bad, because of the effect it has on others, then why did I do it? Because of all the crap he goes through.

He may think, OH, I am just getting my own back, and he may think, I am destroying other lives related to this event.

His mind goes one way, maybe through his family pushing him, but he does take the mental anguish of it all.

It is a catch 22, you either tell or you dont, that is totally up to the individual, and the individual will tell to protect others from this hurt.

Please do not turn it into an argument,

ste

_________________________
Whoever stole the Sun, put it back and we'll drop all the charges!

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#19806 - 07/24/05 10:36 PM Re: Stop the Perps NOW--Young people, prosecute!
Soccer Kid Offline
Member

Registered: 10/22/04
Posts: 273
Loc: Missouri
Glaukos,

I do see it from your side. I'm not much older than you are. Believe me I know the concept is scary, but you are doing it and that is awesome, but not going to be easy.

Another important thing to remember is that you can't criticize other people's actions just like we aren't criticizing yours or anyone else's. Jasper simply made a suggestion and was giving his suggestion to the younger crowd. Because X didn't report something doesn't mean he didn't want to, it doesn't mean that he even could have! Sometimes filing charges isn't easy, sometimes the prosecutor won't accept the case, sometimes the police report got lost, sometimes the perp moved away, sometimes he died, sometimes you moved away et cetera... there could be ANY number of reasons why Jasper didn't report his abuser or take him to court, there could be any number of reasons anyone here didn't including you and others. I didn't report my abuse because I didn't know it was abuse. Now I do, and I'm going to report it. I have already started the wheels. One of my perpetrators has already been convicted once...if I get a shot at him, I'm sure he will be again.

Kevin, you look at things in such a dark light. You are worried about your friends, about how the public feels...worried about being called a liar. Well, even if you lose your case or you lose your friends; you need to now look at it from our point of view now...do you think that whoever you prosecute will be trusted to be a babysitter anymore? Even if you lose? Do you think he will ever be able to not have a watchful eye on him? I bet he won't. I'm sure he will be watched like a hawk. That's a good thing.

I'll be reading your local newspaper kevin to see if anything shows up and checking the TV stations near you to see if they say anything. You never know, no one may ever say a word. You might have nothing to worry about.

Good luck mate. It takes a lot of courage to do what you are doing.

_________________________
~Zach~
Deviant of Many Talents

"Reality is just an illusion."

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#19807 - 07/24/05 10:38 PM Re: Stop the Perps NOW--Young people, prosecute!
Soccer Kid Offline
Member

Registered: 10/22/04
Posts: 273
Loc: Missouri
Zipser,

Yes.

J.D. is an abbreviation for attorney.

_________________________
~Zach~
Deviant of Many Talents

"Reality is just an illusion."

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#19808 - 07/24/05 11:19 PM Re: Stop the Perps NOW--Young people, prosecute!
Don-NY Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 08/06/02
Posts: 546
Loc: Long Island, NY
Jasper,

I was not mocking you. I was using your initial post as a starting point to have you and everyone else consider the other side of this issue.

I am sorry you have taken my words the way you did. I do not say you took them the wrong way. You took them as you took them, and I regret if they hurt you in any way. That was never my intention.

From reading all your posts, I felt that you were in a place emotionally and psychologically where you would see what I was getting at; namely that it isn't about what the young can or should do, OR what the adults can or should do, but about what all of us can or should do WHEN WE ARE ABLE TO.

When I said, "We have met the enemy, and he is us.", that was not directed to you, that was a recognition that all of us have a responsibility. Not just in regards to Sexual Abuse, but to so many issues that plague our world. Where does one begin? Hopefully with an evil that has directly touched our own lives.

We are contemporaries, so I feel certain you will remember another slogan. "If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the problem." Not just you Jasper. This goes to the man in the mirror too.

For the record, I am 52 years old, so this is not an issue of ageism, or us against them, or anything that would divide us.

Also for the record; Yes, I do disagree with your initial proposition. I think it is unfair and wrong to even suggest that young people have a responsibility to protect other young people. That is something that adults and societies must do, not young people, not children.

I hope that you do not leave becasue of this, but that is your decision. I will delete my post if you wish.

Donald

_________________________
If you understand everything, some things are just as they are. If you understand nothing, things are still just as they are.

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#19809 - 07/24/05 11:24 PM Re: Stop the Perps NOW--Young people, prosecute!
Lloydy Offline
Administrator Emeritus
MaleSurvivor
Registered: 04/17/02
Posts: 7071
Loc: England Shropshire
I'm locking this topic for now, not removing or editing anything at this time, just locking it while we take a breather and think about what's being said.

Please don't take the topic elsewhere.

Lloydy

_________________________
Go confidently in the direction of your dreams! Live the life you've imagined. As you simplify your life, the laws of the universe will be simpler.
Henry David Thoreau

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