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#19759 - 07/23/05 08:22 PM Re: Stop the Perps NOW--Young people, prosecute!
Soccer Kid Offline
Member

Registered: 10/22/04
Posts: 273
Loc: Missouri
Jasper,

I'm no longer young enough to pursue any of my perpetrators.

I would like to comment a bit on this topic however and offer my 2 cents worth.

I have 7 different perps in my life...6 were sexual and physical one was just physical. My mother knows about 2 of them, possibly 3. She never took it to trial. I wish she did.

I think that puppy nailed it on the head in his post. It's hard to want to face the person who did it to you. But one thing I can promise is that in the future, when you have healed a bit more, you will wish you had taken them to court.

Puppy is older than the others here from what I gather, he's still younger than me, but not by much. Kevin, Charlie, GuitarGuy et al, are younger. There is a great deal of weight being placed on their parents to make the decision. I often wonder if any of these people live in states like California where victims are compelled to testify in sexual abuse alligations?

Puppy asked a very important question. Why is it his responsibility? Puppy...it's not. But there is a chain going on puppy that you are sadly just another link in, and you seem to be a strong link. The child abused after you, before you and before them and after them all say the same thing: "why is it my responsibility?" That's why the abuse continues.

I'm not going to try to convince anyone to prosecute...but I will say this: for once it's a good idea to be a weak link in the chain. They need to be stopped. If you don't do it, and if no one else does it...they will go unpunished.

"To sin by silence when we should protest makes cowards of men" is a famous quote that I love. Sometimes protesting and standing up is hard, and sometimes it's impossible. But someone has to do it.

_________________________
~Zach~
Deviant of Many Talents

"Reality is just an illusion."

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#19760 - 07/23/05 08:28 PM Re: Stop the Perps NOW--Young people, prosecute!
Kirk Wayne Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 05/31/05
Posts: 499
Loc: Shrewsbury UK
Puppy

"i have lost SO many nights of sleep and convinced myself i am just as bad as him, because i dont have the balls to do something about it. yes other kids are being abused. hes doing it to other kids. he has to be. people like that dont just stop".

This is exactly what happened to me aged 44 but then again I had smothered those memories with the aid of alcohol/drugs for nearly thirty five years.

"but some of us just are not strong enough to do that".

Not at this precise moment in time I suspect most of us have had that thought. Speaking purely for myself I found it easier to talk to a complete stranger as they were not aware of all the emotional baggage that I hauled around with me and they couldnt be judgemental of me as they didnt know me before disclosing.

Puppy you say you are weak, I am afraid I am going to have to disagree, it takes incredable bravery to say the things you have and to admit to feeling weak ... I would say that takes a lot of guts for waht we have all been through no one could ever call us weak, we are survivors and we have endured a lot more than most people could ever take (or ever imagine).

Best wishes

Kirk
"Instigate change, as it appears it wont come naturally in our cause. Sometimes it needs a little forcing".


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#19761 - 07/23/05 08:31 PM Re: Stop the Perps NOW--Young people, prosecute!
reality2k4 Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 07/06/04
Posts: 6838
Loc: Stuck between water, air, and ...
Hi Jasper, yeah, abuse is a dilemma whichever way up or down it is, I lived in fear from 10yo onwards of him coming to kill me and stuff.

No you are not to blame for all the other boys that came after you, but you sure feel like it at the time, I did, it raked me through Hell.

When I was just the little kid, I eyeballed every male who was in my space, and viewed them with suspicion, and I suppose that is one of the magnetic signs for other perps to seek me.

And dont forget it was OK for an adult to slap a kid who they didnt feel was OK with them, and I got a few knocks off adults, for being suspicious of them, and that made my mind feel that they too were perps.

If I look at the young guys in here, then I have found one thing in common, transparency.

A young guy can feel quite alone and alienated, because people who are much older find that they cannot reach out, because of their young age.

I find that I have to reach out regardless of age or whatever else, because it is my paternal instinct to do so, but in the process, they teach me so many things that I had long forgotten.

It taught me how beautiful a boys mind can be, and how creative they can be, something I lost down the line, but now I may be able to rescue some of it by listening to them.

I dont give them advice, but I can help them through some of their fears and feelings, and even if it hurts me to listen, I dont mind if I am helping them through.

ste

_________________________
Whoever stole the Sun, put it back and we'll drop all the charges!

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#19762 - 07/23/05 08:41 PM Re: Stop the Perps NOW--Young people, prosecute!
puppy Offline
Member

Registered: 05/28/05
Posts: 129
Loc: earth
the whole idea of prosecuting him just seems like something in a movie. something that other people do. butnot me. im pretty damn sure that no one would listen or believe anything i had to say anyway. really, how can i prove it. i cant. yes my whole family knows, but none of them have done anything. and none of them seem all that concerned wtih my mental anguish anyway. would they support me? no. my mom let it happen. and she knew and still called me a liar to my face. we have talked about it several times. i know there is no way shed support me. my brother and sister would probably not support me either. my sister lives in her own reality. she wasnt abused by him so hes the greatest dad ever. they have a wonderful relationship. because he only likes little boys. theres a hallmark card in there someonwhere.

my brother went through it all too. and if we had a relationship maybe id ask him how he feels about it. but we dont. so i cant.

no one believes kids who dont have proof. and im not a kid anymore. no one would listen.

if there was a way of prosecuting him without having to see him or talk about it, id do it. if i could make some anonymous phone call and know hed be put in jail or shot, id do it. but i cant. and there is no guarantee that, if i did go through the whole process and tell my sickest secrets to a million strangers, that he would be convicted.

and part of my not wanting to do it is that i dont want to know the value of all my suffering. what ws it worth. ten years of being raped. what is that in prison time? a few months? probation? what am i worth. not much, legally, im sure. if i stumbled upon enough courage to do it and he got some sort of probation, or a few months in jail, or a year, how am i supposed to feel about that. it would destroy me.

and then everyone knows. i grew up in a small town. so suddenly im the boy who is causing all this crap, and for what. so my dad can spend a couple months in jail. and then i can walk around for the rest of my life with a tshirt saying 'my dad raped me' because everyone will already know anyway. and when i go to the store to buy some gum they can all stre and talk about me and my family and is he lying? did you hear the things he said about his father? and they can all hide their children from me because i might end up just like him.

sure maybe it wouldnt be that bad. but maybe it would. there are so many possibilities. and i cant face them. i know i should. morally. for all the little boys i see in malls and parks, just being kids and playing, for all of those kids i should tell someone. because they might be next. or it might have already happened.

so i have all these feelings. and what am i supposed to do with them. im screwed if i do, im screwed if i dont.

_________________________
pUpPy

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#19763 - 07/23/05 08:46 PM Re: Stop the Perps NOW--Young people, prosecute!
Soccer Kid Offline
Member

Registered: 10/22/04
Posts: 273
Loc: Missouri
Puppy,

You do what is best for you. That's the best advice. Go after him, don't go after him. You have to focus on yourself right now.

_________________________
~Zach~
Deviant of Many Talents

"Reality is just an illusion."

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#19764 - 07/23/05 08:58 PM Re: Stop the Perps NOW--Young people, prosecute!
Leosha Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 06/18/03
Posts: 3614
Loc: Right here
I appreciate the enthusiasm and want for justice that prompted this thread. I wish to also say it can put a LOT of pressure on people to so strongly 'suggest' they prosecute.

(Parts of this below may be trigger.)

I have been pushed to do legal action by someone here. I am not a 'youngster' I suppose, I am in my 20s. My two friends from the same country who post here are 19 and 26. Any of us are still in the age in our country where we could attempt to prosecute. A person needs to be READY to take such action. Being young enough to do it does not constitute 'ready'.

Certain circumstances last year pushed me into making a police statement against my main sexual offender. As did another friend who posts here, and another person who does not. Three people 'coming forward' in about a week with complaints against the same man. Should have prompted investigation, yes? And reportedly it did. None of us heard nothing, although at one point I was told by someone I know they had been asked about his knowledge of this man. It gave me positive feelings for whatever the outcome would be. But at the same time, I was not at all ready for this, and the emotional repercussions of the action, and it pushed me back emotionally for several months. I continually had fears and panick of this becoming public, of people knowing this about me (and yes, I know it is not my shame and all that; but I am someone who has want and need for privacy, and this would have quite killed that). Oh, and after six months, when I was in my home country again, they said they could not 'discuss an ongoing investigation'. Earlier this year, when my friend was back in our home country again, he asked about it, and the answer was basically 'um, what? What are you talking about?' Apparantly the 'investigation' has been rather misplaced. As the same thing can still at times happen to people in our country, we remain rather quiet of it right now.

I have three people who sexually abused me, outside of my parents. My one friend here, there were four who abused him (one is since passed away). My other friend here, again, several. It is quite hard to imagine trying to go through the stresses of making reports against all those people, and perhaps, as with our first effort, have it turn out as nothing.

(Another case with bigger triggers below. Details shared with permission of those involved.)

My two other friends who post here, they shared one abuser in commen, simply in coincidence. For one it was a one-time issue, for the other it occurred over many years. This man, after engaging in some stalking behavior, finally had first one, then both of these people make statements against him based on his past activities. He will be in court on trial in September. Not for child abuse. For murdering three teenage boys (three that can be proven) and keeping 'souvenirs' of them. Both of these people have been asked to testify in court, to attest to the violence and torture that this man most likely inflicted on these boys. At least one of them will have to. Both are terrified, and again, very concerned of very private issues becoming public before either is ready.

Yes, it is a powerful thing that the younger members here, even up to possibly age 30 in some cases, have the element of pressing charges at their advantage. However, the power to do that is taken away when you are pressured to act when you are not ready to do it safely. The person who tried to push me to do this before I was ready, he is a good, decent man, one I call friend here. But our friendship was almost lost due to the pressure I felt was being put on me, until we were able to talk about it.

For those who are older here, or whose perpetrators are dead now perhaps, who feel they missed their chance to take legal action, I am sure it is a wonderful thing to think the children and other younger members here still DO have that chance. And it is perhaps hard to not want them to do it. But it must be THEIR choice, when THEY are ready. No one here can heal vicariously through another. If every child, young adult, every person here under age 30 was to prosecute every one of their abusers, child sexual abuse of both boys and girls will still happen. Public executions did not stop crime. Legal consequences do not stop crime. I fear it is dangerous to (maybe unconsciously) wish to use younger victims of this crime to 'stop' these things from happening. It will not stop it, it may make a statement, but whatever words the action speaks, they must be those prepared to be dealt with by the person.

I'm sorry to go on so long here, but the issue greatly triggered my emotions and personal (very) strong feelings, as you can see. I guess the whole of what I am trying to say is please do not harm those already victimized by adding pressure and expectations on their healing.

Leosha

_________________________
Avatar photo in memory of my younger brother Makar.

"Human salvation lies in the hands of the creatively maladjusted."~~~Martin Luther King Jr., 1963

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#19766 - 07/23/05 09:28 PM Re: Stop the Perps NOW--Young people, prosecute!
guitarguy Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 07/11/05
Posts: 12
Loc: Canada
Im twenty, and i was abused at five. I think a lot about what happened, and what I want to do about it.

Now, some might not agree with this, but here it is: I moved away from my home town 10 years later, and my parents are moving back in a year or two. The police I have spoken to say that I have to go to my hometown police to report this, so Im gonna wait. In the 9 months since remembering what happened, the details have slowly come back to me. If i go to the cops I want to be able to go through it all without breaking down again.

The one thing Im not sure about is whether or not Ill go to court. I am being treated for schizophrenia, and my shrink seems to think it would be too stressful for me to face a defence lawyer(the reason why schizophrenics sometimes hear voices is because of stress).

I dunno, everyone seems to go about it their own way. Maybe us younger survivors should take our time. If we KNOW that our abuser is continuing to go after kids then we should think about action.

Times they are a'changin, lets see where the future takes us.

_________________________
how are you?

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#19768 - 07/23/05 09:39 PM Re: Stop the Perps NOW--Young people, prosecute!
puppy Offline
Member

Registered: 05/28/05
Posts: 129
Loc: earth
dont wait too long unless youre sure of the statute of limitations.

_________________________
pUpPy

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#19769 - 07/23/05 09:47 PM Re: Stop the Perps NOW--Young people, prosecute!
reality2k4 Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 07/06/04
Posts: 6838
Loc: Stuck between water, air, and ...
This thread is sure picking up momentum, and I suppose it would do.

We all sing from the same hymn book here, that perps should be prosecuted and jailed.

Police are not helpful, they are intimidating to kids, how could they not be?

Kids are not like adults, they have a lot of fears instilled in them, that says tone down the event.

I remember when it happened to me, and all I wanted to do was to bath this filth off my body.

My father was absolutely ballistic, so we went straight to the police station, and they make me look at pictures, and I think, whoa, how many of them are out there!

I could not go through those photographs and it possibly gave me more nightmares to look at them, but I thought as a child, that thousands of these beasts were in the area where I lived, but dont forget I was only a kid.

I toned down the statement to the police to protect my fathers feelings, and that too is a guilt trip.

My father was only there as part of the interview, but I thought that if I told the truth he would get to know what really happened.

Perps know that most boys will just live in silence, because they are manipulative of them, and their age is always against them, I wish I could be their advocate, and I sure hope other young guys get the justice they deserve.

The analogy is always this, an abused boy or girl, will live a life sentence in their own prison, the perp might get a few years for what they get caught for, but how many lives have they taken before they get caught.

Therapy is cool, but you have to beg for it, or at least in my country, it is not offered at source, and how many abused kids seek it for fear of being classed at mentally unstable!

I remember my dad saying that I have to see a psychiatrist, wow, that is really cool to a kid, when it was not his fault, but the problems that arose from my own abuse made me a freak in my own family.

OK daddy, you think I am mad, and you think I need a shrink, and at such a young age I thought, whoa, why is it all my fault.

No wonder I ran away so much, and hid from everyone, and I only got to know me since I came here, and found that I am not so mad after all.

ste

_________________________
Whoever stole the Sun, put it back and we'll drop all the charges!

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#19770 - 07/23/05 10:32 PM Re: Stop the Perps NOW--Young people, prosecute!
Lloydy Offline
Administrator Emeritus
MaleSurvivor
Registered: 04/17/02
Posts: 7071
Loc: England Shropshire
This is a delicate subject, and one that will surely bring forth very mixed views.

I'm 52yo and have never seriously entertained bringing prosecutions against any of my abusers.
The oldest, the teacher, is probably dead by now. And the two ringleader older boys are about 54 - 55 yo now.
I only disclosed in 1999 and the abuse ended in 1968, so the statute of limitations was up anyway.

But I doubt very much that I would have gone to the law anyway.
I feared the stress involved much more than the possible result, I'd seen perp's walking when cases collapsed from 'lack of evidence'. How much evidence can we provide years down the line? none, it's a flat out argument between lawyers, and we've seen what expensive lawyers can do haven't we?

But I do feel bad that I know both of the older boys were / are still sexually active in dubious ways. I live in the area I grew up in as they still do, and I now have good contacts to find out such things.
Would that knowledge have made much difference to my choice to stay silent? none at all - however hard that sounds.

I made my choice on purely selfish grounds, I came first, and I still do.
If I have any 'efforts' spare then I do use them for others, which is why I find myself here and at Axis helping survivors in any way I can, but it's NEVER at my expense.

And I refuse to allow myself to guilty or weak for not chasing them through our legal system.

Dave

_________________________
Go confidently in the direction of your dreams! Live the life you've imagined. As you simplify your life, the laws of the universe will be simpler.
Henry David Thoreau

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