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#18919 - 10/02/03 10:37 AM can I live with it
malitovsky1 Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 09/23/03
Posts: 11
Loc: Atlanta
I am 48 and most of my life I knew that 'something' happened to me as a child. I was able to acknowledge my father's physical abuse and readily talk about. However about 2 months ago this 'something' became clearer with flash backs of my mother sexually abusing me. I am totally devistated and have been since. I went to a trauma inpatient program and continue in outpatient therapy. I need to add at the same time the images appeard my therapist of five years retired, I broke up with my girlfriend and my son who was living with me left for collge. A lot to handle for sure.

But I continue to feel nothing but shame. I feel it was my fault and I am dirty and perverted and everyone knows. I attend AA and my ex-girl friend does also. After I broke up with her she went back to her old boy friend(who also attends the same meetings)within 2 days. Even though I had initially broke up with her(about 3 days before the flash backs began) I feel that I was not able to keep her because she now knows what a sick person I am. I need to say I can challenge these feelings and intellectually know they are false but the feelings are truer to me. I seem paralyzed with shame. Affraid to show my face at AA meetings, I mean everyone will know I broke up her and tried to get her back but I lost her to her old boy friend. When the images began I phoned her but she would not answer most of the time and when she did she did not tell she went back to her ex and was avoidant. Behavior she never had shown in the 5 times previous I broke up with her for this same reason. By the way the reason I broke up was because durring the year or so we were together I felt she was still emotionally attached to her ex. Of course she denied it but in the end I was right(painfully so). I know that I should be glad that she did not respond in my time of crisis when my flash backs began but it still hurts and the shame is terrible. The shame I feel from the abuse is linked to my relationship with her.(crazy?)I am sorry for this long post but I am lost. A close friend committed suicide one week ago and initially I felt envy. Sick???? While I have thought about it I just cannot leave my 2 boys with that legacy. But that really seems the only reason. I also have suffered with severe chronic nerve pain in right leg for the past 12 years 24/7. With all the emotional pain I just do not have the resources to deal with the physical pain as I was before. As a recovering narcotic addict I am unable to take pain meds. I have tried under medical supervision and they still set off my addiction.

What to do? Where to go? HELP!!!


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#18920 - 10/02/03 11:44 AM Re: can I live with it
outis Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 02/27/03
Posts: 2260
Loc: Maryland USA
malitovsky1,
Quote:
But I continue to feel nothing but shame....intellectually know they are false but the feelings are truer to me
It's pretty common to "know" but not "feel" the truth of whose shame it really is. All I can suggest is that you keep telling yourself what you know to be true-the shame belongs to the abuser.

Quote:
Affraid to show my face at AA meetings, I mean everyone will know I broke up her and tried to get her back but I lost her to her old boy friend.
I don't believe that's what most people in an AA meeting are going to think. I imagine that they each have other concerns related to recovery from alcoholism.

Do you have a sponsor? This sounds like the kind of thing you should be able to discuss with a good sponsor. I may be a little hazy on the concept, but I think a sponsor is supposed to help you apply the program's principles to own your life.

Can you attend other groups/meetings for a while until you feel stronger?

This group on MaleSurvivor is something like a 12 Step group in that we're here when you want to share, and we'll say, "Keep coming back" and "Take what you like and leave the rest." So in light of those quotes, why don't you take a look around at some of the discussions we have had here? Look at some of the papers available from the home page. See where you can recognize some of the effects of sexual abuse in our lives as familiar in your life. You're not alone in this. Unfortunately, many men (and women) endured seuxal abuse in childhood. Fortunately, we can help one another in recovery by coming here to read/write/vent.

Here's something else to take on "intellectual faith" until you can feel the truth in it. Things can get better specifically for you.

Joe

_________________________
"Telemachos, your guest is no discredit to you. I wasted no time in stringing the bow, and I did not miss the mark. My strength is yet unbroken…"—The Odyssey, translated by W.H.D. Rouse

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#18921 - 10/02/03 04:20 PM Re: can I live with it
malitovsky1 Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 09/23/03
Posts: 11
Loc: Atlanta
Thanks for your reply. I have been told that I will eventually begin to feel what I know to be the truth intellectually. But it does not seem to be happening. The shame still feels like it's on me. As far as my ex and the AA meeting I appreciate your input. Here too I know my shame has little to do with my ex and everything to do with my childhood sexual abuse. It is like everything is mixed up all together and inseparable. I have been going to AA for over 20 years and sober about 16 of them. I was 11 years sober when I developed the chronic pain which lead to relapse. I think somehow I need to find the courage to go there and act as if I were not shameful. I think somehow that way I eventually find the shame to be a lie. But I do believe the lie currently.

Again thanks.
Gary


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#18922 - 10/02/03 05:23 PM Re: can I live with it
Stephen_5 Offline
BoD Emeritus
MaleSurvivor
Registered: 09/12/00
Posts: 667
Loc: Northern California Foothills
Gary,

I can only agree with Joe:

"It's pretty common to "know" but not "feel" the truth of whose shame it really is. All I can suggest is that you keep telling yourself what you know to be true-the shame belongs to the abuser."

Trying to rationlize the the intellectual knowledge with the emotional feeling is one of the things I've been dealing with for years and years. The knowledge is from an adult perspective and the emotions come from the child I was. I need to talk to the child I was and teach him what the truth is.

Take good care of yourself,

Steve

_________________________
I want to stay as close to the edge as I can without going over. Out on the edge you see all kinds of things you can't see from the center.
Kurt Vonnegut (1922-2007)

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#18923 - 10/10/03 02:57 AM Re: can I live with it
Leosha Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 06/18/03
Posts: 3614
Loc: Right here
I am sorry that you go through so much all at once. It is so hard, I understand that. I can relate much to so much hitting at once. But, you can live with it. There are many strong, brave men here who prove that so much. Without the support here, maybe I would not be living with it so much either. But this place works wonders, and saves me more then once.

I think maybe, it would be good for you to find new AA group? Just, the added pressure of being there, with your ex-girlfriend, and her boyfriend, that is not something that you need. You are most important right now, and do not need to be expending energy on them.

Please do keep coming here, this is really a place of strength, wonder, and magic. I welcome you, and share your grief and sadness, as well as the strength that is within you, that you maybe do not recognize now.

leosha

_________________________
Avatar photo in memory of my younger brother Makar.

"Human salvation lies in the hands of the creatively maladjusted."~~~Martin Luther King Jr., 1963

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#18924 - 10/10/03 04:31 AM Re: can I live with it
Bill_1965 Offline
Chat Mod Emeritus
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 06/29/03
Posts: 1983
Loc: Flint, Michigan
malitovsky1,

This is some real good advice and insight that these guys have been giving you.

Leosha's suggestion that you go to a different AA meeting, so you do not have to see your ex and her boyfriend, is a sound suggestion. No need for that added stress at this time.

I started my healing just before my ex left me. She has physical custody of our son. And really absolved myself in it for the past several months. Complete with all the trimmings, flashbacks, not eating, afraid to go to sleep, and on.

Always knowing I wasn't at fault or had anything to be ashamed of, but not believing it. That was until a few weeks ago. Then I was able to look back clearly at the years of SA and other abuse and see it as it was. And I found that I was not to blame. So why should I be ashamed?

With prep #1, I was young (just turned 11) and terrifed of him throughout the experience. With prep #2, I was already pre-de-sensitized by #1 and #2 pruned me into thinking this is what guys do to all little boys. With prep #3, she always had me feeling humiliated and set me into a deep depression. Perp #4 used this depression to capitalize on the opportunity to use my how she wanted, leaving me further depressed, ashamed, and totally used. Perp #5 was a doctor, after two visits, I never went back. This was followed by physical abuse by my first wife. Shall I call her #6?

A few days ago a T called to see how the treatment I had a few weeks ago was holding up. I could still look back and see what happend. I haven't had a flashback, I still am having night terror, with the exception of last week when I did nothing but sleep. I can't tell what is what right now. When I was sleeping all the time I was on 6,000 mg of Vicadin amd 2,400 mg of Motrin for the intense pain I am in, along with the AD, AA, anti-hystimenes, and the rest of my daily coctail of meds. My pain meds have been reduced, and I am still scatter-brained. Just 2-3 weeks to go until I find out if I will lose one of the boys or at least a part of it. When this passes, I will be able to reassess where I am and where I need to go next.

And by the way. Suicide is a lousey option. Your two sons would be the ones that pay the price for that. Something I wish I had the ability to think of before I made my bonehead move almost a year ago.

Where to go? Go to a different AA meeting. Go to your T and pDoc. Come here, your among friends that understand.

How to do? Take care of your self. Work through your issues at a pace that you are comfortable with. Talk with us, we'll listen.

Be good to yourself,

Bill

_________________________
Pain is Temporary; Quitting lasts Forever. - Lance Armstrong

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#18925 - 10/10/03 06:38 PM Re: can I live with it
crisispoint Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 09/24/03
Posts: 2154
Loc: Massachusetts
I can't really add anything to what has been said here. They are all great comments and suggestions, save this. Talk.

Talk to people who you know are safe
Talk to your therapist about EVERYTHING you feel, remember, do to survive.
Talk so that you can regain control of your life.
Talk to command the demons instead of them commanding you.

I didn't think I could survive either, both as the child who was abused, or as the man who remembered. I am. It isn't easy, but it's possible. Especially if you consider it for what it is: a work in progress.

Be well. Peace and love,

Scot \:\)

_________________________
There are reasons I'm taking medication. They're called "other people." - Me, displaying my anti-social tendancies

fromacuriousmind.blogspot.com
malehurtandsurvive.blogspot.com

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#18926 - 10/10/03 06:55 PM Re: can I live with it
Lloydy Offline
Administrator Emeritus
MaleSurvivor
Registered: 04/17/02
Posts: 7071
Loc: England Shropshire
Gary
Quote:
A close friend committed suicide one week ago and initially I felt envy. Sick???? While I have thought about it I just cannot leave my 2 boys with that legacy. But that really seems the only reason.
Isn't that just ONE reason of many ? Think about it.
I've lost friends, and my brother just survived his suicide attempt. It isn't any kind of answer, no matter how deep the shit pile.

There's another pile here, just read those replies - what a pile of support, friendship and help.
Just when you thought there was nothing left, you turn up here.

Welcome.

Dave

_________________________
Go confidently in the direction of your dreams! Live the life you've imagined. As you simplify your life, the laws of the universe will be simpler.
Henry David Thoreau

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#18927 - 10/13/03 10:45 AM Re: can I live with it
malitovsky1 Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 09/23/03
Posts: 11
Loc: Atlanta
I want to thank everyone for their help. I am just putting one foot in front of the other right now. It seems like I am not going anywhere most of the time. I want to go back to the time when I did not recall what happened. I hate the way I feel. But I can't go back and that is reality just like what happened is reality. Reality sucks most of the time.

I am not happy. I just feel so sad inside. I wonder if it will ever change. My children love me and are concerned. I know they just want me to be happy. As I do. But it is not to be right now, I guess. All I have been able to do is write on this board and talk to people. All of them say it will get better but I want it to be better now. Oh I will just keep on the journey.

Gary


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#18928 - 10/13/03 08:24 PM Re: can I live with it
Bill_1965 Offline
Chat Mod Emeritus
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 06/29/03
Posts: 1983
Loc: Flint, Michigan
malitovsky1,

I read today that depression can be caused by not expressing or acknowledging your feelings. Looking back at the bouts of depression I have had throughout the years, I can see a bit of truth to that statement.

Let those feelings out, not as a burst of rage, but share them with someone that you trust, share them with us. Reach inside yourself and pick out one of those feelings and talk about it. Then grab another one. Share them, release them. The more you talk about them, the less they will pester and hound you.

A friend of mine has this saying,
Quote:
Life sucks, but it beats the alternative.
I don't believe that life sucks, just this moment we seem to be stuck in. I believe that life is a wonderful and joyous place to be, I have seen peeks of it through the cloud that has covered me for so many years. And the weather is beginning to break.

The journey is tough, rocky and long and at times you will get bogged down a bit. But keep on chugging along and you will get there. And the trip will be worth it.

There is no magical pill we can take to get from here to there. Only pills of diversion that temporarily relieve the pain and throw us off course and give us more pain later.

Hang in there malitovsky1, we are here if you need a hand.
Bill

_________________________
Pain is Temporary; Quitting lasts Forever. - Lance Armstrong

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#18929 - 10/13/03 08:45 PM Re: can I live with it
Mike Church Offline
Moderator Emeritus
MaleSurvivor
Registered: 01/23/03
Posts: 3439
Loc: Toronto, Canada
Malitovsky 1

Every time that you think life sucks remember what you just posted
Quote:
My children love me and are concerned. I know they just want me to be happy.
Your children love you and are concerned. Despite everything you have become a great father and that in itself sure doesnt suck.

Now let me tell you about depression and suicide. Been there. Tried that. Not sucessful thank god. But the one time that I was sure I was sucessful I never wanted to live so much as I did then. It is rough tuff and dangerous but living is the only thing I know.

_________________________
Mikey

IT REALLY IS OK TO STUMBLE. NONE OF US ARE PERFECT.

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#18930 - 10/14/03 02:22 AM Re: can I live with it
zoltin Offline
Member

Registered: 10/13/03
Posts: 37
Loc: Southern Illinois
Gary,

First let me say that I believe you are incredibly courageous. Anyone who has stayed sober as long as you has great courage. You have learned to defend yourself. You could not defend yourself when that happened to you as a child. Please find a way to be good to yourself. Buy yourself flowers or take a long bath - do something.

I too belong to AA and have been sober for 21 years. I too am 48 yo. The ones at AA whose opinions I care about are there for recovery, not to judge others' actions. And I would definitely discuss these matters with a caring sponsor. If you feel you cannot count on your sponsor to listen, understand, and not judge, you might consider finding a new sponsor. On the other hand, if you are comfortable using other resources to work out your abuse, by all means do that. You have a right to your own boundaries and the right to enforce those boundaries. If someone chooses to be hurt by you taking care of yourself, so be it.

I have used my resources in a divided way. I have spoken with my sponsor about the sexual abuse in a general way and about how I feel it has affected my relationships with women. For the most part, though, I use therapy for sexual abuse recovery. I am a new member here and intend to use this a lot. I have also used Adult Children of Alcoholics as a recovery vehicle and found it very helpful.

My prayer is with you, man. Be well.


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#18931 - 10/17/03 01:03 AM Re: can I live with it
gryffindor Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 02/08/03
Posts: 131
Loc: St. Charles, Illinois
Malitovsky,

About your chronic pain -- have you checked to find out if your local medical center or hospital has chronic pain center? Have you tried biofeedback? If you can force yourself to relax the muscles that surround or are near the nerve it might help to reduce the pain. I cured myself of chronic nerve pain in my arm and shoulder by forcing myself to relax muscles that I initially didn't realize were tense. Eventually the nerve "unlearned" the pain it caused me.

Mary

_________________________
"Where there's a will, there's a way." American Folk Saying

"Had I not fallen, I could not have arisen; had I not sat in darkness, I would not have recognized the light." Midrash Tehillim Ch. 22

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#18932 - 10/17/03 01:38 AM Re: can I live with it
bowman Offline
Member

Registered: 04/19/03
Posts: 72
Gary,

I think the sadness does pass eventually, once you have done the greiving you needed to do, about your mother, the lost trust and innocence, about the toll this has taken on your life. It seems like the feelings vary in intensity, and when it gets really bad, that will still pass.

I know what you mean about how the shame gets wrapped up in current events in your life. I find that I'll totally overreact to something someone does, and if I think about it, there is some parallel to past situations, but the intensity is definitely because of the feelings from the past. I find that if I can link up the feelings to the past events, and let the feelings come up, then eventually they pass.

This is hard stuff. Be easy on yourself.

Ken


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#454418 - 11/19/13 07:56 AM Re: can I live with it [Re: malitovsky1]
une.vie.d.espoir Offline


Registered: 12/06/10
Posts: 113
Loc: Quebec-Canada
I started to see whos birtdays it was so HAPPY BIRTHDAY and all the good stuff to you.

I have read your life and most of mine strugle whit my dad suicide. If you need to talk I am reaching my hands to you.

Whit care

Jean-Pierre

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