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#188025 - 10/20/07 09:58 AM Re: Drop the Corpse [Re: SEVEN ARROWS]
John Oarc Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 02/10/06
Posts: 633
Loc: Louisiana

Just a thought to ponder,

According to the Bible people who do not turn from evil or people who do not ask for forgiveness and repent ultimately end up in hell, again according to the Bible- not me.

Therefore, God “drops the corps” when there is no remorse and no change in behavior, there is no forgiveness and hell is the eternal destination right?

With that said, we should feel less guilt ridden if we choose not to forgive the ones who do not care what they do to others and continue the lifestyle to their death bed.

Forgiveness, the only way to rid you from this crazy ride, not true, I am positive it is not the only way. If God has limits, I think its okay for all of us as well.

I think you can drop the corps or let the perp go for your own health and wellbeing with the proper semantics or without them. I think the key is knowing that it does not mean you are okay with what happen, you don’t like what happen, you don’t agree that it was appropriate. You are not releasing the perp from the crime you are releasing yourself from it in order to get on with your life and that means dropping the past and moving forward without the corps.

Another key element is knowing that waking up one day and saying “I will drop the corps today” is not the way it happens, it is a process. Kind of like a light bulb going off in your head, it just happens after working and processing it for some time.

This is a discussion forum, so I kind of think we should have discussion. Discussion means we hear all sides of the point without the emotional baggage of who is right and who is wrong. What is right for you has everything to do with about a million different variables and can not be predicted. What you feel has a lot to do with your stage in your own recovery. When I was in the stage of discovery I hated the perp and forgiveness was the last thing on my mind. As timed passed I changed many times over. So with that said, just remember we are all at different stages with different views.

I hope we can keep and open mind and allow others to express themselves without feeling they will be condemned for their thoughts.

_________________________
Whatever It Takes, God


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#188092 - 10/20/07 07:56 PM Re: Drop the Corpse [Re: John Oarc]
RICK57 Offline
Member

Registered: 12/31/03
Posts: 1611
Loc: ENGLAND
I was going to add something profound, but I've had a good day today, and forgot what it was I was going to say!

But then again, I remembered. I've been clearing my patio that was totally overgrown. Each year, I've cut the plants back because they were taking over the yard. Every time I cut them back, they just came back stronger. Most of the plants in there had memories attached to them. I remember where and when I bought some of them, but some of the most intrusive ones were bought for me by people who are now dead!

I felt really guilty taking those plants out and sending them to the recycling plant. I am about to replant the whole area with plants that I have selected.

I will forgive myself for destroying my patio plants as soon as the new ones grow. I will not forget the clematis that flowered every May (40 foot spread), that was bought for me.

Life is about balance, if people do good things for you, then you can forget the bad. If people only do bad things to you, then **** them!

_________________________
*Never look down on anybody unless you're helping them up.
*I was seeking a way of expressing my anger - I found hope!
*There are many battles before the war is won! It can be won!

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#188100 - 10/20/07 09:49 PM Re: Drop the Corpse [Re: RICK57]
Still Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 02/16/07
Posts: 6356
Loc: 2 NATO Nations
I truly want to let the anger and rage go. I truly do! However, I'll need to do that without forgiving them. I fully believe that the perps need to ASK ME FOR FORGIVENESS before I can grant it.

Will I let the anger and rage go? I hope so. I'm trying to now. The taste is so bitter. The effects are so powerfuly negative.

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#188105 - 10/20/07 10:08 PM Re: Drop the Corpse [Re: Still]
FormerTexan Offline
Site Administrator
MaleSurvivor
Registered: 09/12/04
Posts: 11020
Loc: Denver, CO
Rob,

I hear ya, but what if a perp is dead?

Andy

_________________________
List of things ain't nobody got time for:

1. That


If I could meet myself as a boy...

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#188106 - 10/20/07 10:23 PM Re: Drop the Corpse [Re: Still]
melliferal Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 11/03/05
Posts: 1159
I kind of hope I never reach the point where I can "forgive", where what was done to me becomes "OK" and no longer bothers me. I was complacent and cooperative when I was a kid. I "looked the other way" quite enough while I was abused. The ability to be upset, the ability to be indignant about what was done to me, is a new found ability that I treasure so much. The ability to stand up and say "NO - what was done to be was NOT right, and it is NOT okay" gives me a measure of power over my perps, NOT the other way round. It reminds me that I matter. And I find this "let bygones be bygones" suggestion to be a suggestion that what was done to me did not, in fact, matter after all. That's what forgiveness means, in the most objective sense. And I'm not going to cheat and change the definition of forgiveness so that I can somehow "forgive" my perps WITHOUT saying that what happened to me was just fine. My perps hurt kids. Forget that it was me - that doesn't even matter. They HURT KIDS. With intent and absolutely no remorse.

If there's a God, He can forgive them if he wants. I am not God.

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Children cannot consent; they can only comply.

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#188413 - 10/22/07 11:26 PM Re: Drop the Corpse [Re: Still]
Mike 999 Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 09/09/06
Posts: 18
Loc: Midwest
Originally Posted By: Robbie Brown
I fully believe that the perps need to ASK ME FOR FORGIVENESS before I can grant it.


AMEN to that Robbie

_________________________
The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results.
Benjamin Franklin

Knowing and not doing is equal to not knowing at all.



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#188488 - 10/23/07 05:35 PM Re: Drop the Corpse [Re: Mike 999]
River Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 10/23/07
Posts: 112
Loc: Nashville,Tennessee
Do you think forgiveness is a choice or is it more of a process? If I could choose... I believe I would have already make that choice..right? I am a long way to forgiving my perpetrator, which is complicated by his death. The other perpetrator was a stranger ... that kind of complicates things also. I cannot imagine forgiving for the perps benefit... it has to be for my benefit. As for the "stuff" that comes from the pulpits of our "most sacred places" ... I just don't know. What I do know is that God's grace is just BIG ENOUGH for me today.



Edited by River (10/23/07 05:38 PM)
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#188495 - 10/23/07 06:56 PM Re: Drop the Corpse [Re: River]
FormerTexan Offline
Site Administrator
MaleSurvivor
Registered: 09/12/04
Posts: 11020
Loc: Denver, CO
I think it's more a process in these cases. It makes no sense to say one day "I forgive perp X" and then be pissed about it all again the next day. It does make sense to process the hurt and anger, then be able to forgive it.

_________________________
List of things ain't nobody got time for:

1. That


If I could meet myself as a boy...

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#188560 - 10/24/07 04:03 AM Re: Drop the Corpse [Re: FormerTexan]
Mike 999 Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 09/09/06
Posts: 18
Loc: Midwest
I totally agree with you Tex. Its not like someone is asking forgiveness for breaking your new toy this is your childhood they broke.

_________________________
The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results.
Benjamin Franklin

Knowing and not doing is equal to not knowing at all.



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#188601 - 10/24/07 10:05 AM Re: Drop the Corpse [Re: frost]
Power_water Offline
Guest

Registered: 09/14/07
Posts: 45
Loc: Portland, OR, USA
I conciously believe in the concept of forgiveness. I Tried it. With utter conviction, I tried it three very seperate times.

I told my self, and God and, my abusers (who weren't there at the time, I was alone)

I told them that I forgave them, and put them into God's hands

But just weeks or months later, new pain and, new memories/flashbacks and new HATRED would burst into my mind with overpowering bright hot burning force. Evil and sick, twisted and torturing, of loathing and shame.

And I would wonder to myself, as I lay curled in a fetal position on the floor, Did I really forgive them? Can I ever?
I think the answere is I still have to dig deeper, and find out more. And I can't do it alone.

Maybe in time. I would really like to cut the corpse off of my back.
I would really like to let it go and feel free of the unpredictible rising flame of burning hatrid, that I sometimes missplace on others. Oh well, only time and God will tell. And I do see SLOW but real improvement, two steps forward, one and a half steps back.

I want to forgive, but I feel like God hasn't given me the power yet.

_________________________
Bring works of darkness to light

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