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#184343 - 10/03/07 09:42 AM manipulative
Jarrad Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 10/27/06
Posts: 1071
Loc: arizona
someone told me the other day that i am manipulative. to me, this has all these negative meanings and its not very nice to be called this. so i thought about it and even went as far as to look up the exact meaning. "skillful in influencing or controlling others to your own advantage." then im like.... yeah i totally do that. i didnt realize that i do that in everyday life, and that can still be debated, but that is totally something i picked up when i was hustling. the more you can sway a guy to pay you more or even trying to get him to want certain things instead of other unfavorable options... i think thats a good thing, no? if i am able to get more money from a guy i see that as a good thing. if i can make a guy want a blow job and not anal sex... possibily even for the same price... i think that's a good thing.

so okay.. i have this learned bahavior thing. but apprently its negative in everyday life. i still am not sure how i am manipulative now. like, i really don't see it. am i oblivious? is it so second hand that i don't know im doing it? and if i dont know im doing it, how do i change it?


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#184355 - 10/03/07 10:29 AM Re: manipulative [Re: Jarrad]
ak Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 01/10/04
Posts: 1491
Manipulative. That is interesting. I know that this is coming from someone of English-is-a-second-language, so it probably is not a worthy answer. But what I have 'seen' of you, on board and chat, I would not call you that. I do not always agree with what you say or how you say it, and am sometime easy offended by you, which is of course, about me, not you. (just being honest). But I have felt 'manipulated' by persons here before, and in real life, and I have never felt that from you. A lot of time we do not see negative (or positive) things of ourself. But also, sometime, what one person say may be very much 'off base' because they are having a bad day, or are being a jerk or something.

I think you will get other answers here who will I hope be from people here who know you better. I hope that they will give to you the information you wish.

Andrei


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#184359 - 10/03/07 10:42 AM Re: manipulative [Re: ak]
Jarrad Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 10/27/06
Posts: 1071
Loc: arizona
andrei, thanks for replying. (i enjoy the english-as-a-second-language guys here. you guys add another layer of depth to the site.) but thanks for your ideas on it. i know that a lot of people dont agree with me. i know i am loud and out there. and i didnt think that all translated to being manipulative. i guess part of me doesnt understand the meaning of it completely. i dont know.


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#184379 - 10/03/07 11:37 AM Re: manipulative [Re: Jarrad]
buzz_key Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 03/31/07
Posts: 635
Loc: USA
jarrad...it is cool to see you exploring parts of yourself.
all i can speak of is what i have read from you...i d not see you being manipulative on this site.
manipulation can also take the form of saying things in a certain way so that you get the answer you are "wanting"...not the person's honest answer.
there are many ways to manipulate...but they all boil down to doing or saying something to cause someone to do or say or think what you want.
buzz


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#184425 - 10/03/07 01:36 PM Re: manipulative [Re: buzz_key]
Paul1959 Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 05/17/06
Posts: 525
Loc: NYC
I also think manipulation can also take the form of taking something that someone says out of context, or instead of responding to the basic intent of a point someone is trying to make, someone picks up on a tangent or reads something into what somebody said that simply was not the point of the discussion. It seems to me that when that happens, people are forced into a defensive mode and can no longer make progress on the original topic. In this situation I think it could be said that a topic or discussion was manipulated to suit a person's interest.
Paul
Paul


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#184430 - 10/03/07 02:05 PM Re: manipulative [Re: Paul1959]
trusty Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 05/14/07
Posts: 167
Loc: Indiana, USA
Hey Jarrad,
I don't see you as a manipulative person at all. You have strong opinions and don't mind sharing them. (You know that I have even referred to you once as being "blunt".) But I appreciate your honesty. That is a positive from my point of view.

Thanks,
Russ/Rej

_________________________
"To be yourself in a world that is constantly trying to make you something else is the greatest accomplishment." - Ralph Waldo Emerson

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#184432 - 10/03/07 02:11 PM Re: manipulative [Re: trusty]
mogigo Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 04/24/07
Posts: 1331
Loc: Colorado
Yea, I have never seen it Jarrad. Just "blunt" like trusty says. Refreshing.

Mike

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Thriving

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#184435 - 10/03/07 02:32 PM Re: manipulative [Re: mogigo]
rcm Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 08/24/07
Posts: 156
Loc: Boston, MA
Jarrad,

I think becoming aware of our behaviour can be very enlightening. It can help us move forward and understand how and why other folks respond to us in certain ways.

My concern after reading your post is that, once you realize you have a communication pattern that appears manipulative, IF that is the case, it may make you feel guilty? I hope it's not the case, as you can use this knowledge to move forward.

It is interesting to explore with our t our own behaviour, communication patterns and how we feel about them. IOW, it's ok since we are learning from this and growing.

Just my point of view. I sincerely hope it helps. I haven't posted lately and was hesitant to do so but wanted to give you my input.

~Raul

_________________________
______________________________________________
Prince Zuko: [looking at a map] How am I going to find the Avatar? He is clearly a master of evasive maneuvering.
Sokka: [cut to him, looking at the same map] You have no idea where you're going, do you?

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#184442 - 10/03/07 03:13 PM Re: manipulative [Re: rcm]
dannym Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 03/24/07
Posts: 543
Loc: Boulder, Colorado
I agree with whatever Jarrad says... always... and I came to that decision all by myself (right Jarrad?)

xoxo
Dan

_________________________
"You should listen to your heart, and not the voices in your head."

Marge Simpson

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#184447 - 10/03/07 04:01 PM Re: manipulative [Re: dannym]
shadowkid Offline
WARNING from ModTeam, September 2013: user "Shadowkid" was exposed as a hoaxer. His entire online persona and stories of sexual abuse were fiction. We encourage you not to become emotionally concerned by anything you see in any of his posts. Thank you
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 11/18/05
Posts: 2437
is intimidation the same as manipulation?

_________________________
its not hard to fall
when you float like a cannonball - damien rice

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#184530 - 10/03/07 10:36 PM Re: manipulative [Re: shadowkid]
Jarrad Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 10/27/06
Posts: 1071
Loc: arizona
shadow, i dont know, but it might be simmilar. am i intimidating? i think i would say i am more intimidating more than manipulative. both are negatives but with intimidating, i think thats because im blunt. but then am i blunt because im manipulating people? ugh i dont know.

in terms of the site, yeah i have been blunt but not because im trying to shock people its because i really want to make a difference. and yeah, sometimes posts can get derailed but really, i am not the only one who comments on something someone says, and not the orginal post. to me, this is a difficult thing. on one side, i can see that the orginal poster can get pissy if you talk about a comment someone makes. but on the other side, it opens it up for the post to other places that the orginal poster might not have expected and that can be enlightening.

thoughts?


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#184531 - 10/03/07 10:38 PM Re: manipulative [Re: shadowkid]
Jarrad Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 10/27/06
Posts: 1071
Loc: arizona
oh and rcm, yeah it does make me feel guilty (just add it to all the other guilt i have) because i dont know when im doing it. and that the unnerving to me. if someone can say "you are manipulating people" or whatever, that to me, is very serious. but what freaks me out is that i honestly dont see it. so thats why i feel guilty.. i mean, am i doing it now?


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#184546 - 10/03/07 11:45 PM Re: manipulative [Re: Jarrad]
mogigo Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 04/24/07
Posts: 1331
Loc: Colorado
Wow that is good, but what is the alternative really, to shut up. Feels like almost questioning your very existance.

Second guessed myself for a long long time. Not fun.

Love ya brother
Mike

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Thriving

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#184549 - 10/04/07 12:28 AM Re: manipulative [Re: mogigo]
mogigo Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 04/24/07
Posts: 1331
Loc: Colorado
Thought a bit about this a bit more, Used to tell my "old" friends "sorry, I'll just shut up". Said that alot. New world, new rules. Feels kinda good \:\)

Mike

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Thriving

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#184551 - 10/04/07 12:32 AM Re: manipulative [Re: mogigo]
theatrekid Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 06/03/07
Posts: 702
Loc: oregon
Jarrad i feel like you are a manipulative sob.

just kidding your fun to be around and you say whats on your mind but as much as i have talked to you on here i dont see you as being manipulative at all.

but maybe your just so good at manipulating i dont even realize its being done... oh shit im in trouble now jarrad the puppet master controlling everything at MS....

again im just kidding your not manipulating relax my friend. you have had to go through alot of stuff because of the abuse that happened to you. i hope eventualy you will be able to let the guilt go.

,Chris


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#184576 - 10/04/07 01:59 AM Re: manipulative [Re: shadowkid]
VN Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 06/03/05
Posts: 723
Originally Posted By: shadowkid
is intimidation the same as manipulation?


No. Intimidation is what Jarrad sometime do. Manipulation is what you done here.

VN


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#184705 - 10/04/07 06:58 PM Re: manipulative [Re: VN]
Lazarus Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 07/01/07
Posts: 851
Loc: Below the radar, USA
Jarrad;

There are two sides to every communication; the speaker and the listener, or in this case the writer and the reader.

One man's persuasion might be another man's manipulation. I'll let you be the judge.

Also, there are a lot of adjectives that are commonly thought of as being negative but which are not necessarily so. Many people say that because I have an ego, I am an egotist. Having a strong ego is a compliment; it means you are confident and self-aware. Being an egotist is often seen as a negative, meaning self-centered. As far as I'm concerned, they are opposite sides of the same coin.

Selfishness is another one. If someone say's I'm selfish, I take that as a negative. But in reality, everything I do is selfish or in my own best interest. For example, I drive the speed limit because it is selfishly in my best interest not to get a speeding ticket. Likewise, I give my children love, attention and lavish them with gifts when I can, because (from one perspective) it gives me great joy to do so. Sure, they get something out of it too (a loving father and presents!) just like society as a whole gets something out of my not exceeding the speed limit (civil order and less traffic accidents); but that's not the reason I do it. It's all selfishness.

My point is; from what I know of you, you are a selfish, egotistical, manipulative person. And I mean that in the best possible way; I don't think you have a mean-spirited bone in your body. I could also have said that I think you are a confidant, persuasive person who helps others simply for the pleasure of doing so. Same thing, different perspective.

See the difference? (if not, I can elaborate even MORE... LOL)

All the best,

Lazarus

_________________________
"That which does not kill us, surely makes us stonger." - Neitsche

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#184722 - 10/04/07 08:15 PM Re: manipulative [Re: Lazarus]
Jarrad Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 10/27/06
Posts: 1071
Loc: arizona
haha no i get it laz. that an interesting way of putting it. i had never thought about it in that light. thanks.


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#185953 - 10/09/07 06:30 PM Re: manipulative [Re: Jarrad]
Lazarus Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 07/01/07
Posts: 851
Loc: Below the radar, USA
Boy, I sure know how to kill a conversation, don't I???

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"That which does not kill us, surely makes us stonger." - Neitsche

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