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#180274 - 09/14/07 11:43 AM Sexuality... a double standard
cbfull Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 01/26/07
Posts: 386
Loc: Ohio
One of the things that gets under my skin is how quick guys tend to be to proclaim that they are "straight" when not even asked. It seems that all someone has to do is make the slightest hint about questioning someone's sexuality and they regard it as their special moment to proclaim their complete heterosexuality. Apparently if you don't answer (which you should never feel you have to answer), you will be suspected of being gay.

Wouldn't it be nice if men and especially young men (or girls) in general would regard that as an invasive and inappropriate question and refuse to answer? Let the insecure moron think whatever he wants, he'll be so confused and feel like such an ass when he assumes almost all of the guys he knows are gay and then wonders why most of them date girls. Okay, I guess I don't really want anyone to feel that bad, afterall it's not their fault they don't know any better.

It's rather sickening to hear anymore. I was just on a supplement website the other day and someone was rambling about rectal administration of compounds, and one of the other members made a joke about "questioning" the guy's sexuality. He quickly responded to "clear the air" of any doubt and announced that he was "straight". It made me nauseous just to read it.

I hate to even go on and analyze it further, I think we all know how it is a double standard. It's okay to be one but not the other. I'm just so sick and tired of everyone being afraid of sexuality. I realize that it's difficult and it's going to take time to undo the damage that has been done (mostly by catholicism), but I just feel like I need to vent.

Labels are unforgiving in the strictest of terms, and by that definition they demand perfection (what does straight really mean anyway?). Which, in that case, dictates that nobody is truly straight. Just like black people are not really black and white people are not really white. Human beings are naturally sexual, curious and intelligent. Given that why would we purposely limit ourselves when it comes to physical pleasure?

I consider myself to be completely same-sex oriented (I don't even like to say that I'm "gay" anymore), but I honestly believe that if the labels and the stigma did not exist at all (which is near impossible to imagine, another painful frustration), my sexuality would be far more varietous. I'm almost certain that my preference would be for men, but I think that all the negative pressure has made me completely disgusted by the idea of sharing sexual pleasure with a woman. Why should I be disgusted by it? Why not just dissatissfied? Or why not just simply not interested?

Craig

_________________________
Craig

Guilt and shame have never done any of us any good at all.

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#180307 - 09/14/07 02:15 PM Re: Sexuality... a double standard [Re: cbfull]
MarkK Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 04/02/07
Posts: 2503
Loc: Denver, CO
Craig,

I want to thank you for a well-worded and (I believe) heart-felt post. Labels do little more than get us in trouble when we mislabel someone - or they aggrivate by making a person feel boxed in by the definition.

We are so much more than just our sexuality or gender or orientation or ... etc etc etc

Thank you.

M


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#180322 - 09/14/07 03:27 PM Re: Sexuality... a double standard [Re: MarkK]
cbfull Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 01/26/07
Posts: 386
Loc: Ohio
Thank you so much mark, I wasn't even thinking about being heard, I was really just sorting out my feelings and venting frustrations. Labels cause people a lot of unnecessary grief and despair, yet we are in the habit of using so, so many of them everyday. Maybe that's why it's impossible to imagine life without them.

You are so right about labels getting us in trouble - and as far as I can tell, any label is a mislabel.

As someone else here stated, "Labels are for cans"

_________________________
Craig

Guilt and shame have never done any of us any good at all.

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#181841 - 09/23/07 08:40 AM Re: Sexuality... a double standard [Re: cbfull]
cat lover Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 10/09/05
Posts: 89
Loc: Denver, Colorado
Yeah, interesting thought. I also wish more of us would come out of the closet. Yesterday I was at a café with some friends, one of whom is highly closeted. An attractive woman walked in, and one guy said to the closet case, hey, there's your date. The closet case didn't correct him. Another presumption of heterosexuality. Yes, heterocentrism exists.


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#181863 - 09/23/07 10:29 AM Re: Sexuality... a double standard [Re: cat lover]
FormerTexan Offline
Site Administrator
MaleSurvivor
Registered: 09/12/04
Posts: 11106
Loc: Denver, CO
Craig,

I have a feeling there is too wide of a variety of viewpoints to accomodate everyone when it comes to these labels. Personally, I have had people assume I'm gay. One man PMd me and asked "As a gay man, do you find.....?" I was wondering what I did to help him believe I was gay, which I am not. On the other hand, at times I've seen one guy or another make the chat room about being gay. I was like "I get it. You're gay. So what..?"

Regarding what you said about it being invasive, I agree. There is a gay man at worked who more or less outed a woman on the spot. "She likes girls" I was told. I already knew this, however he did not know I knew and had no business outing her. I corrected him and said "ya know, most people would say none of your business when asked about their sexuality. You sure you want to just out her like that?" He did not take me seriously. What gives? Doesn't he hate that when it happens?

So without saying a thing, I've had people label me, and I've seen them label others.

I see the double-standard in both camps.

_________________________
List of things ain't nobody got time for:

1. That


If I could meet myself as a boy...

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#181866 - 09/23/07 11:08 AM Re: Sexuality... a double standard [Re: FormerTexan]
shadowkid Offline
WARNING from ModTeam, September 2013: user "Shadowkid" was exposed as a hoaxer. His entire online persona and stories of sexual abuse were fiction. We encourage you not to become emotionally concerned by anything you see in any of his posts. Thank you
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 11/18/05
Posts: 2437
so now if im not gay im fucked up? why is it that gays seem to be so militant about it?i dont care one way or the other in most situtations im interested in being a friend ,not a lover.or if i been abused im gay but afraid to admit it? like in chat most nights you can find gay guys talking about gay sex ,something that is a trigger for me. but if straight guys talk about hetro sex its like ewwwww! the standard i think has turned a full 360 ,now if im not gay im either lying and in the closet or im an outcast ,the same shit that always used to be used against being gay is now being used against straight guys. everybody hated it when gay people were discriminated against ,should those same people now be doing it to straight guys? also who came up with the term being in the closet? to many it means hiding your sexuality ,to me it was the place i was held captive ,my real prison not some place i created to hide my sexuality. one thing that gets under my skin is guys rushing to proclaim i'm gay and if you dont like it then your fucked up ! but they never ask if i like it or not before they say fuck you.its like everybody just assumes that straight guys dont like gay guys ,and we all know what happens when we assume ,it makes an ass of u and me. gay or straight dont mean shit to me . i just wanna be your friend is that so hard to understand?

_________________________
its not hard to fall
when you float like a cannonball - damien rice

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#181897 - 09/23/07 05:29 PM Re: Sexuality... a double standard [Re: shadowkid]
WalkingSouth Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 08/30/05
Posts: 16265
Good point, Adam. Just a friend.

Like has been said here so many times. Label's are for cans. Let's get over it already.

_________________________
“Life’s journey is not to arrive at the grave safely in a well preserved body, but rather to skid in sideways, totally worn out, shouting ‘Holy ____…! What a ride!’” ~Hunter S. Thompson

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#185034 - 10/05/07 09:13 PM Re: Sexuality... a double standard [Re: shadowkid]
Danbuff Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 08/03/07
Posts: 249
Loc: NY state
everybody hated it when gay people were discriminated against ,should those same people now be doing it to straight guys? also who came up with the term being in the closet? to many it means hiding your sexuality.

Wow, I see some sweeping generalities throught this thread about sexual orientation. I also see both points being made but I need to comment on Adams statement above. To read it I see an implicit message that gay discrimination is all in the past. I am here to tell you it is very much alive with all the other opressive and discriminatory attitudes and beliefs about minorities, races and women to name a few. It also does not matter where the term came from about being in the closet, the fact is there are plenty of closets where people hide. Closeted cross dressers, who are not gay, closeted overeaters, closeted racists. Pick anything. Bickering really only creates higher walls where people dig in and it becomes increasingly difficult to understand and respect someone who is different. Yes Adam, there are plenty of gay men who think that some guys are closeted but I don't think it is necessarily intended to be deragatory. It is really a shallow assumption or maybe it is true. What consenting adults do in thier private life is nobody's buinsess. However being openly gay is still a challenge in America because there is still a great deal of homophobia. Go to any PRIDE event and look at the fringe of radical people with signs like GOD HATES FAGS. Persoanlly, I never care about your sexuality, it is more to with your character. I will say I agree with you about just wanting to be a friend. I guess both sides get uptight and defensive on the issue. Perhaps when we are comfortable with our own sexuality and tolerant of others we won't necessarily need to get into disputes. Let us all all try to make it a better world for each other. Like the bumper sticker on my friends car says. If you want peace, work for social justice

_________________________
When you stumble, make it part of the dance.

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#185130 - 10/06/07 11:11 AM Re: Sexuality... a double standard *DELETED* [Re: cbfull]
krayoss Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 02/18/01
Posts: 112
Loc: west
Post deleted by krayoss


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#185282 - 10/06/07 05:48 PM Re: Sexuality... a double standard [Re: krayoss]
Danbuff Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 08/03/07
Posts: 249
Loc: NY state
Well stated Krayoss.

I am also a Catholic and the remarks about Catholocism were indeed one more example of sweeping generalities. When in actual fact, the sad but ugly priest sex scandal actually may represent about 2-3 percent of the priest population. And without defending the way it was handled, if you stop for a minute to think that simply relocating the abusive priest was the answer back in those days. Knowledge about what to do with abusers has come a long way in the past 15 years. Again, I am also a victim of CSA, but I will not blame the church for all of the abuse. That is hurtful and irresponsible to say even if you want to believe it. It is callous and perhaps not intended, but it is what is is. Those priests were individual sick abusers and the recommendations probably came from a consultant who said move the priest. That is what they did. Is it right? Hell no, absolutely not. I have to look at the greater good and bigger picture where the Catholic church is concerned. It is true they do not support me a agay man, but as one outstanding example of humanity said.... "In the end it is between me and God" Mother Teresa Also a Catholic!

I agree that we are here to support each other and not be attacking anyone.
In Peace,
Dan

_________________________
When you stumble, make it part of the dance.

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