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#172422 - 08/10/07 03:41 PM Therapists?
Frog Offline
Guest

Registered: 08/05/07
Posts: 291
Loc: Arizona
Got a huge pissed off weight I'm carrying right now...

I'm trying to find a T here in Phoenix that specializes
in MALE CSA...and all i am finding so far is male/female
and a lot that help both the abused and the abuser...

I'm not even remotely comfortable w/ that last one, in
fact I find myself very pissed about it...its like they
are riding the fence...I understand the abusers are sick
twisted individuals and need these services but for these
places to offer those services to both sides of the coin
seriously pisses me off...how can they do that?..





Edited by Frog (08/10/07 03:42 PM)
_________________________
A Native American elder once described his own inner struggles in this manner: "Inside of me there are two dogs. One of the dogs is mean and evil. The other dog is good. The mean dog fights the good dog all the time." When asked which dog wins, he reflected for a moment, "The one I feed the most."

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#172433 - 08/10/07 04:00 PM Re: Therapists? [Re: Frog]
roadrunner Offline
Administrator Emeritus
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 05/02/05
Posts: 22045
Loc: Carlisle, PA
Frog,

The problem with abusers is that so many of them are serial offenders; that is, they go for one boy after another. The man who abused me, for example, was a Scout leader and a friend of mine (also abused) and I sat down once and figured that he may have got through half the boys in the troop. Some have abused hundreds over their lifetime. So the first purpose of therapy for abusers is to get them away from their perpetrator habits. An abuser who doesn't get help and is just thrown in jail will get out one day soon and perhaps just start all over again.

Much love,
Larry

_________________________
Nobody living can ever stop me
As I go walking my freedom highway.
Nobody living can make me turn back:
This land was made for you and me.
(Woody Guthrie)

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#172438 - 08/10/07 04:35 PM Re: Therapists? [Re: roadrunner]
Frog Offline
Guest

Registered: 08/05/07
Posts: 291
Loc: Arizona
How can these therapists treat both the abused and the abuser
at the same practice? Isn't that dangerous...I know
how ANGRY I am...if I found out my T was also treating
an abuser I would FREAK...

_________________________
A Native American elder once described his own inner struggles in this manner: "Inside of me there are two dogs. One of the dogs is mean and evil. The other dog is good. The mean dog fights the good dog all the time." When asked which dog wins, he reflected for a moment, "The one I feed the most."

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#172439 - 08/10/07 04:38 PM Re: Therapists? [Re: Frog]
hideout Offline
Guest

Registered: 08/09/07
Posts: 84
Loc: michigan
frog, you have to remember that if an abuser is seeing a therapist willingly they are trying to get help
abusing is a big problem, some people cant control it
there is no excuse for it and it is wrong, i almost killed the person who did it to me, still want to
but think about it in retrospect


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#172440 - 08/10/07 04:45 PM Re: Therapists? [Re: hideout]
Frog Offline
Guest

Registered: 08/05/07
Posts: 291
Loc: Arizona
I hear your point...atleast they are getting help...they
are human beings right?

_________________________
A Native American elder once described his own inner struggles in this manner: "Inside of me there are two dogs. One of the dogs is mean and evil. The other dog is good. The mean dog fights the good dog all the time." When asked which dog wins, he reflected for a moment, "The one I feed the most."

Top
#172441 - 08/10/07 04:49 PM Re: Therapists? [Re: Frog]
hideout Offline
Guest

Registered: 08/09/07
Posts: 84
Loc: michigan
yup:)


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#172482 - 08/10/07 07:12 PM Re: Therapists? [Re: Frog]
roadrunner Offline
Administrator Emeritus
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 05/02/05
Posts: 22045
Loc: Carlisle, PA
Frog,

Originally Posted By: Frog
How can these therapists treat both the abused and the abuser at the same practice? Isn't that dangerous...I know how ANGRY I am...if I found out my T was also treating an abuser I would FREAK...


A therapist who treats abusers isn't doing so with the idea of excusing what they have done. The aim is to reduce the chances that the abuser will re-offend and to remove this risk from the community.

In fact, from what I have heard an abuser gets a pretty rough time from the T, in that the T expects him to acknowledge what he has done, understand the catastrophic harm he has caused, and take 100% responsibility.

An abuser isn't instructed, for example, on how to seek forgiveness. He's told this can only come if the survivor wants to forgive him, and if that happens he should regard it as the most amazing gift in the world. Even then, he has to understand that the survivor has the right to withdraw his forgiveness at any time. If the abuser complains "My son won't even take my calls", the T doesn't pity him; he tells him, "Of course not. What do you expect after what you have done?"

Much love,
Larry

_________________________
Nobody living can ever stop me
As I go walking my freedom highway.
Nobody living can make me turn back:
This land was made for you and me.
(Woody Guthrie)

Top
#172485 - 08/10/07 07:18 PM Re: Therapists? [Re: roadrunner]
Frog Offline
Guest

Registered: 08/05/07
Posts: 291
Loc: Arizona
That helps thank you...

I just don't feel comfortable w/ a T who is willing to
treat both sides...although it does say a lot about the
T's heart....how much compassion and understanding would
that T have to have to see it from both sides and treat
both sides...

I may have to reconsider my first thoughts on this...
thanks RoadRunner for stimulating my mind on this
topic...you ROCK...

_________________________
A Native American elder once described his own inner struggles in this manner: "Inside of me there are two dogs. One of the dogs is mean and evil. The other dog is good. The mean dog fights the good dog all the time." When asked which dog wins, he reflected for a moment, "The one I feed the most."

Top
#172492 - 08/10/07 07:26 PM Re: Therapists? [Re: Frog]
roadrunner Offline
Administrator Emeritus
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 05/02/05
Posts: 22045
Loc: Carlisle, PA
Frog,

I'm glad you made this comment:

Originally Posted By: Frog
I just don't feel comfortable w/ a T who is willing to treat both sides...


That's absolutely okay, bro! YOU have to decide how you feel about your T and whether you are comfortable with him. If something doesn't feel right, well, it doesn't feel right and you have to find a solution. In therapy your priority has to be your own issues with the abuse, not issues with the T, so in your case I would say working with a T who treats both survivors and abusers may not be a good idea. I wouldn't try to convince you otherwise. I was just trying to provide information on what actually goes on (so far as I know) when a T is working with an abuser.

For the record, I would have to say that 2 months ago I thought exactly as you do in your post here. Then I began reading a book manu>
_________________________
Nobody living can ever stop me
As I go walking my freedom highway.
Nobody living can make me turn back:
This land was made for you and me.
(Woody Guthrie)

Top
#172580 - 08/11/07 09:01 AM Re: Therapists? [Re: roadrunner]
Ken Singer, LCSW Offline
Moderator Emeritus
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 08/24/00
Posts: 5780
Loc: Lambertville, NJ USA
Larry is referring to my book. It is the first one written (to my knowledge) that brings the experience of working with abusers to help survivors understand the con that the abuser put on them way back when.

I've been working in the sexual abuse field for nearly 30 years, with adult and adolescent abusers and male survivors. There have been survivors as well as partners who cannot understand that a therapist can work with both populations and not be contaminated or "take sides".

I take the side that abuse is wrong, harmful and completely unexcusable. I demand accountability from my abuser clients and don't accept excuses.

My work with survivors makes me a better therapist with abusers, to help sensitize them to the damage they've done with the primary goal of never abusing again.

My work with abusers helps me work with survivors who have been set up and conned by the abusers. It helps identify and facilitate changes in the belief systems that survivors frequently have of being responsible somehow for the abuse. It also helps dispell the myths that many survivors hold onto that keeps them stuck and living in fear and/anger.

More later.

Ken


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