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#168853 - 07/24/07 08:39 PM Do I have to decide between God and Therapy?
buzz_key Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 03/31/07
Posts: 635
Loc: USA
I have been in T for a few months now and feel as though I have come a long way...prior to starting T I was deeply involved in my church, Elder, media coordinator, men's group, etc...since T started, I have stopped all service in my church because my recovery takes up so much of my time and mind...

Over the past three weeks I have been on hiatus from T due to attending Summer Camp with my two sons...the camp is a church camp and served to refresh my spirituality and connection with God...I found myself pondering why the two, recovery and church, have been seperate to this point.

I suppose I initially seperated the two because I felt so ashamed of the things I have done...I recently have come to realize that I haven't been trusting God to be who He is...my Creator who can do ANYTHING...including helping me through my recovery. I am trying to marry these two important parts of my life.

After being at camp I was ready to stop T and dedicate my recovery process to prayer and the will of God solely... but I believe that the two can supplement each other...at least I am going to give it a shot.

I would appreciate any input from anyone who may have struggled similarly.


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#168858 - 07/24/07 09:34 PM Re: Do I have to decide between God and Therapy? [Re: buzz_key]
MarkK Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 04/02/07
Posts: 2502
Loc: Denver, CO
I have bounced back and forth between my service to God and "getting whole". Especially with the thought that I shouldn't be in any kind of leadership when my life is so screwed up.

It's only recently I realize that God can use me WHILE I am being healed. Besides - I can find no where that He says we have to be complete BEFORE we come to Him. For obvious reasons - that wouldn't work.

My 2 cents? Go with your instinct - the two CAN supplement each other.

M


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#168868 - 07/24/07 10:12 PM Re: Do I have to decide between God and Therapy? [Re: MarkK]
Pete2004 Offline
Moderator
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 08/06/04
Posts: 958
Loc: North Carolina
Buz:

I whole hearted believe in prayer and the ministry of the church. This belief has become a part of my DNA and my recovery will never be complete outside of my Faith. However, I have seen and experienced enough to know that there is great wisdom available to us through secular counseling that respects our beliefs.

In the midst of this journey,>
_________________________
There is a destiny that makes us brothers;
No one goes his way alone;
What we send into the lives of others,
comes back into our own. (Edwin Markham)

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#168872 - 07/24/07 10:24 PM Re: Do I have to decide between God and Therapy? [Re: buzz_key]
Army Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 06/27/07
Posts: 90
Loc: California
Hey Buzz,

Remember Romans 8:28 for all things work together for good to those who love God, to those who are called according to His purpose. Remember? I know its hard to see right now, but Gods word is true, yesterday today and tommorow. Its true for your life today. The God who loved you yesterday still loves you today, he was with you in your abuse, with you in your acting out, with you in your doubt, He is with you in your recovery. He brought you to a place to find his love again.

I too have been and still am in the Church as a Minister/Elder/Pastor, I also am a survior of sexual abuse as a boy. I did alot of things too that were acting out with older men. I remember crying out to God and asking for help to heal me from these things, Its been twenty years and I can finaly say he answered my prayers. As I began to Trust the God of the impossible, I was reminded that with God all things are possible, even bring peace to my torment and shame and fear. In His mercy, he showed me that I wasn't giving enough credit to His children. Those that are truely born of His love will see your situation in God's eyes, and you will find God's grace, mercy and love. You have with me, and I serve Jesus Christ the God of the impossible! My advice to you is stay in therapy, don't hold anything back. Put it all out on the line and ask God to help you sort it out. He will help, He is trustworthy, He loves you, and He desires His relationship with you, so pray read and pray and read. I will be praying for you my friend!

Army

_________________________
07 Peebbles WOR Alummni

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#168874 - 07/24/07 10:31 PM Re: Do I have to decide between God and Therapy? [Re: Pete2004]
buzz_key Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 03/31/07
Posts: 635
Loc: USA
Mark- very good point that we don't need to be complete before coming to Him...that IS why we need Him.

Pete- your 'targeted' messages is something that happens to me very frequently as well...I simply LOVE it when that happens...it serves to strengthen my faith that God is actively involved, interested, and desiring a close relationship with me.

I appreciate your feedback guys...


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#168875 - 07/24/07 10:36 PM Re: Do I have to decide between God and Therapy? [Re: buzz_key]
buzz_key Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 03/31/07
Posts: 635
Loc: USA
Army...WOW! You just said exactly what I told my T yesterday...I am so tired of being partially whole, still carrying around certain secrets...it MUST be dealt with, ALL of it...so that it doesn't keep it's hold on me...I have resolved to put it all out there, and trusting God to be there to see me through it.

THANK YOU for your prayers.


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#168876 - 07/24/07 10:44 PM Re: Do I have to decide between God and Therapy? [Re: buzz_key]
Army Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 06/27/07
Posts: 90
Loc: California
Buzz,

Great Stuff, I wish I could say its gonna be easy, but ya know nothing good comes without pain...look at Jesus. Lot'a pain and agony there, but that was Friday...Sunday is a coming!

Blessings,

Army

_________________________
07 Peebbles WOR Alummni

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#168895 - 07/25/07 12:56 AM Re: Do I have to decide between God and Therapy? [Re: Army]
Halibut Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 08/29/06
Posts: 228
Loc: Alaska
Hi Buzz,

Like Army I too work for the Church, I'm a priest. If you broke you leg you'd go to a doctor, if you had a heart attack you'd call the ambulance. God works through the medical people as well as through prayer. It would be irresponsible for us to rely on God to fix our leg when there are doctor's available. Please continue therapy. It was tremendously helpful for me, though difficult. I've had several surgeries and evey one of them involved pai and then the pain of rehabbing and physical therapy...it's the same with the pain of CSA.God will give you what you need as you need it:to speak the unspoken which needs to come out for it is true and only in the daylight can be recognized and healed.

Blessings,

Frank


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#168902 - 07/25/07 02:57 AM Re: Do I have to decide between God and Therapy? [Re: Halibut]
pietie Offline
Guest

Registered: 01/23/07
Posts: 326
Loc: South Africa
Hi Buzz

Due to the fact that I could not afford a T I fought through the past few months. I use to see a T when I was about 18 and some of the views is still helpful today.

I am doing well due to the fact that I gave God my everything and believe in Him as my healer. If I had the choice I think I would still see a T as that is helpfull. But I also find a lot of support in my church. I have shared with my pastor about the abuse as well as with one friend in church. The support is awesome!! By no means is it substituting a T but my point is simply that God gives us people to help us through the difficult times. Wheather that is a T, a pastor or just a good friend. However that is something you should work out for yourself.

I agree with what was said above. If we wait for everything because we still have issues and secrets we will never start with anything. My reason for being on MS is because I wanted to be healed and whole before I start my theological studies. Through the past few months I have learned that if I wait for that I will never start with my studies as there pops up a new thing everytime I think I am on my way. So I have started with my studies and I am glad I did. God works through us no matter where we are or what we are struggling with. He is not looking for our ability but our availability.

Good luck with your journey it is worth it!!

_________________________
Not Perfect, just forgiven

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#168948 - 07/25/07 12:11 PM Re: Do I have to decide between God and Therapy? [Re: pietie]
terpprm Offline
Guest

Registered: 06/15/07
Posts: 312
Loc: Elyria, Ohio
i have grown up in church my entire life. actually my perp was a pastor's son from another local church. i never told anybody and got through it on my own. not completely, there are still some problems i deal with. my opinion, i think your pastor should be your therapist. God has a way of using the Man of God to help people. the issues i'm dealing with now, i am discussing with the pastor and the music director(mostly the music director) which is also one of my best friends, my sunday school teacher, my leader(i'm the church organist), and they have helped me so much and it doesn't cost you an arm and a leg!!! my favorite part:-) anyway, you can never go wrong by partnering with God. by choosing God, you can continue with both and probably even get more out of it, because you can serve God with your whole heart and most pastors are on a call me anytime basis. i have my pastor's cell phone number so that if i have a problem, then i can call him anytime, and he always answers!!! just my opinion. i'm sure there's someone here who won't agree with me.

_________________________
My Story

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#168964 - 07/25/07 02:22 PM Re: Do I have to decide between God and Therapy? [Re: terpprm]
MarkK Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 04/02/07
Posts: 2502
Loc: Denver, CO
I too have my best friend and counselor in my pastor. But that hasn't always been the case. I've also had pastors who almost destroyed my life.

I think people of God are like everyone else. Some are good, some aren't. After all, forgiven doesn't mean perfected....

my 2 cents

M

_________________________
the story
    https://1in6.org/men/bristlecone/mark-krueger/

Kirkridge - October 2008
Alta - September 2012
Alta - September 2013

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#168970 - 07/25/07 02:57 PM Re: Do I have to decide between God and Therapy? [Re: MarkK]
theatrekid Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 06/03/07
Posts: 702
Loc: oregon
as some of you might already know I'm not really a religious person. but why can't you do therapy and still be involved in your church? God wants you to be healthy so if a T will help you feel healthy i think its okay to give up some of your church time for your recovery.

,Chris


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#168987 - 07/25/07 04:27 PM Re: Do I have to decide between God and Therapy? [Re: theatrekid]
terpprm Offline
Guest

Registered: 06/15/07
Posts: 312
Loc: Elyria, Ohio
your right chris. you can have both. there isn't any reason you can't have both. i just prefer not to pay for t. my perp was a pastor's son. and my previous pastor wronged me big time, but on a different subject. so i understand about those of you who don't trust clergy, because they've been wronged by them. it's just my personal preference.

_________________________
My Story

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#168989 - 07/25/07 05:04 PM Re: Do I have to decide between God and Therapy? [Re: terpprm]
MarkK Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 04/02/07
Posts: 2502
Loc: Denver, CO
for what it's worth - I try to keep my T within the same "belief system" as where I am. It just makes it less clumsy at times, knowing they won't recommend something I wouldn't do, or balking at how I handle something because of my faith.

M


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#168994 - 07/25/07 05:24 PM Re: Do I have to decide between God and Therapy? [Re: MarkK]
ttoon Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 06/19/07
Posts: 977
Buzz,

Okay...shocker here...but my second therapist advertised himself as a "Christian Counselor."

Because I think that, in recovery, using what you know only helps to facilitate the process. Therapy is about improving the quality of our relationships...the relationship you have with God will also be improved through the process.

Not one or the other...but both. If your therapist is not up for it...then it is a failing on his or her part...there are some really good Christian Counselors out there. :-)

My faith has only been enhanced through this process...


Dave

_________________________
checkin out for a few weeks... whistle
02/07/09

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#169016 - 07/25/07 08:14 PM Re: Do I have to decide between God and Therapy? [Re: ttoon]
buzz_key Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 03/31/07
Posts: 635
Loc: USA
Everyone....EXCELLENT discussion going on. My T is very deep faith wise...and that has really helped.

God has really been speaking to me - conversations, books, etc. - about the fact that He is the source for this healing...and I agree, He provided T's to assist those in need.


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#169397 - 07/27/07 09:47 PM Re: Do I have to decide between God and Therapy? [Re: buzz_key]
WalkingSouth Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 08/30/05
Posts: 16264
Quote:
I found myself pondering why the two, recovery and church, have been seperate to this point.

Buzz,

To my way of thinking, the most ideal model of recovery is a melding of the two. I would think to those who are spiritually minded that they could not be separated in the long run.

At least recovery and spirituality. Church and recovery are a totally different story. Many time I think Church and religion can be a detriment to recovery if either or both are not also spiritual, and how many churches/religions are out there that "have a form of Godliness, but deny the power thereof?" Far too many I think.

You'll find what you are looking for. Just keep looking.

Lots of love,

John



Edited by walkingsouth (07/27/07 09:50 PM)
_________________________
“Life’s journey is not to arrive at the grave safely in a well preserved body, but rather to skid in sideways, totally worn out, shouting ‘Holy ____…! What a ride!’” ~Hunter S. Thompson

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#169710 - 07/29/07 11:56 PM Re: Do I have to decide between God and Therapy? [Re: WalkingSouth]
Mark Antony Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 01/03/07
Posts: 34
Loc: Michigan
I say pray about everything. When you are done praying then it is time to take action. Like get a councelor,ect. I view the Christian faith as one of action pray first so we are inspired on what to do. Do not just pray and wait for results. We need to be involved with our life not just let it happen to us. Church and a councelor are a very good combination the compliment each other well, when you have the proper councelor.

Mark Antony


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#442427 - 07/28/13 03:52 PM Re: Do I have to decide between God and Therapy? [Re: buzz_key]
BuffaloCO Offline


Registered: 07/14/12
Posts: 422
Loc: USA
I think the two can go hand in hand. I use a Christian T and am working on healing. I know God is in that with me and if I'm not as active at Church as I would like to be, I think it's because He wants me to focus on the healing He is providing for me. I do try to read scripture daily and connect daily with God in prayer. I know it will take time for my process, but God brought me to the right people to help me in this, so I'm sure he's ok with what I'm doing. It does help to check in with Him daily too. smile
_________________________
“We can easily forgive a child who is afraid of the dark. The real tragedy of life is when men are afraid of the light.” - Plato

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#442436 - 07/28/13 06:54 PM Re: Do I have to decide between God and Therapy? [Re: buzz_key]
genedebs Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 11/09/12
Posts: 285
Loc: MO
Dear Buzz

Clearly There is no need for conflict,just as you would seek help from professionals for restoration of health, the help from professionals for mental health is the same.

To open yourself (just as it is for me) to God's mercy is part of the healing process. To expect all professional to be excellent is unrealistic, whether they be clergy or otherwise. Some of my experiences have found my unwillingness to follow the advise of my rabbi Some of my experiences have found me unwilling to follow the recommendations of my therapist.

Whether I was right or wrong when I did that, doesn't matter. I have continued to "act justly, love mercy, and walk humbly with my God." Also, I continue in therapy.

We all have different stories and we all are just the same.

Go with God

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#442620 - 07/30/13 12:22 PM Re: Do I have to decide between God and Therapy? [Re: Halibut]
Lenny Offline


Registered: 07/19/13
Posts: 20
Loc: Kansas
Great point Halibut about how we go to the doctor for a broken leg or illness and we don't give it a second thought. I never have prayed asking God if I am to go the doctor when I am not feeling good. The Trinity loves us so much that they want to work within our good and bad choices to bring us to be our best in this broken world.
Originally Posted By: Halibut
Hi Buzz,

Like Army I too work for the Church, I'm a priest. If you broke you leg you'd go to a doctor, if you had a heart attack you'd call the ambulance. God works through the medical people as well as through prayer. It would be irresponsible for us to rely on God to fix our leg when there are doctor's available. Please continue therapy. It was tremendously helpful for me, though difficult. I've had several surgeries and evey one of them involved pai and then the pain of rehabbing and physical therapy...it's the same with the pain of CSA.God will give you what you need as you need it:to speak the unspoken which needs to come out for it is true and only in the daylight can be recognized and healed.

Blessings,

Frank



_________________________
No one can make you feel inferior without your permission
Don't take anything personally
It's not the event, it's the meaning applied to it

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#442622 - 07/30/13 12:39 PM Re: Do I have to decide between God and Therapy? [Re: MarkK]
Lenny Offline


Registered: 07/19/13
Posts: 20
Loc: Kansas
MarkK has a good point. As we all know that pastors and priest "Men of God" can be abusers. Good reminder MarkK that not everyone in the faith are safe.
_________________________
No one can make you feel inferior without your permission
Don't take anything personally
It's not the event, it's the meaning applied to it

Top
#442802 - 07/31/13 07:00 PM Re: Do I have to decide between God and Therapy? [Re: buzz_key]
Wife - Survivor Offline


Registered: 02/03/13
Posts: 38
Loc: PA
Sorry I didn't see one this before. My experience is that BOTH church & T are quite valuable. I have arranged my time to allow for both - because both work, for me. I did leave the catholic church - just couldn't stay focused because I was abused by a priest. Sooo I am now a Methodist, with a female pastor ! We all need to look for "the grey in the middle" and find our niche.
I would still be crazy w/o the Therapy and I would be crazy w/o my God in my life. Pls don't give up on T; just get it ALL out or it's a waste of money & your life's wonderful possibilities.
_________________________
Everyone DESERVES Recovery, IF they WANT it.
Anything worth it, takes mucho Time & Willingness.

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