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#168213 - 07/21/07 05:13 PM Re: were we helpless? [Re: Jarrad]
Cidnie Offline
Guest

Registered: 07/09/07
Posts: 113
Loc: SFC, CA
And I agree with Alex ^^^^
The only way to validate and give credence to our own individual thoughts on whether or not we were helpless needs a 'why' which brings up anecdotes. It's to be expected.

_________________________
There is nothing natural about maturity in the physically immature. Maturity comes with wisdom, and wisdom comes with pain. Those of us with the greatest minds have endured the greatest torments.

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#168222 - 07/21/07 05:35 PM Re: were we helpless? [Re: Cidnie]
Xavier91 Offline
Guest

Registered: 06/11/07
Posts: 84
Interesting question.
I would like to say that yes I was helpless.
I was 5 years old and that man was like a giant compared to me.
But that's not your question.
Could I have told someone? Not my 'mother' as she was the one selling me to those guys.
Could I have told someone else? Not really. I was 5 years and had no clue what it was that they did to me. I could not have worded it right even if I had wanted to.
I was growing up in a house where the only constant thing was violence. I was like this little adult trying to protect my younger brothers from this violence, trying to keep them fed, clothed, brought them to school, the one that made them shower and took them to the hospital when they were so sick or hurt that medical attention was absolutely necesarry.
What had I learned about adults? Don't trust them. Adults hurt children. If you tell them, they will split you up, put you in fostercare for a half year or so and then send you back to your 'mother' anyway, cause she had kicked of of drugs and alcohol... And yes she had... for a few months at the most and then things were back to 'normal' again.

So why did it stop for me? After she had gone crazy from to much drugs and alcohol and stabbed me with a kitchen knife. over and over again. She almost killed me. The doctors had given up on me cause i had just lost to much blood. Thankfully I pulled trough anyway. I was 8 years old at the time.
Finally we got taken away from our 'mother' for good and had the luck that the last fosterfamily we had stayed with for a while was willing to adopt all 3 of us.

So was I helpless? I think so.

And I would like to echo cidnie and alex, ask these kind of questions and get this kind of answers back.

Was everyone helpless? I guess in essence the answer would be no. But the reason the kid didn't tell, is because of so many different reasons... for every kid.. You can't like say they weren't helpless they could have stopped it... Cause that would be like saying it's their own fault or they were just to dumb or weak to stop it...
Just my point of view...

Xavier


_________________________
Rather laugh about what has been
Then fear what still comes, perhaps
Rather loving a big ghost
Then hating something that you canít see

You are gone, but closer then ever

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#168259 - 07/21/07 07:46 PM Re: were we helpless? [Re: roadrunner]
Lazarus Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 07/01/07
Posts: 851
Loc: Below the radar, USA
All I can add is that awareness has shown many of today's kids that sexual advances from an adult is wrong and they don't have to accept it. It's a hard topic to discuss with your kids, but they need to know. If only I had known...

Lazarus

_________________________
"That which does not kill us, surely makes us stonger." - Neitsche

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#168284 - 07/21/07 09:44 PM Re: were we helpless? [Re: Lazarus]
FormerTexan Offline
Site Administrator
MaleSurvivor
Registered: 09/12/04
Posts: 11027
Loc: Denver, CO
"but i just cant help to think that there is something, a character flaw or something, that made us vulnerable enough to be abused and allow it to happen. all of us did allow it."

The question was never a problem for me. The statement "all of us did allow it" was the problem for me. If I allowed it, then I have to own all the guilt and shame and provocation. Then I am the one responsible for what happened to me. In short, it was all*my*fault. And this totally flies in the face of what we are learning as survivors, that it was not our fault this happened to us. This is why that statement was a trigger tripper for me. The question is fine. It was the followup that posed too great a challenge.


_________________________
List of things ain't nobody got time for:

1. That


If I could meet myself as a boy...

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#168401 - 07/22/07 11:54 AM Re: were we helpless? [Re: Stefan012]
MrEdd Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 01/24/03
Posts: 317
Loc: Texas
My mom wouldn't listen to what was happening.
She wouldn't not take us there.
I couldn't make her believe.
She said I was making things up to not go.

I tried screaming.
They held my nose shut
and did my face until I passed out,
then locked me in a closet
until I learned not to cry.

I tried running
I got carried naked back to a urine stained matress
And fucked anyway

I tried fighting
You can imagine how well that worked when I was four
or when I was five
or when I was six
or when I was seven
or when I was eight
or when I was nine
or when I was ten
even when I started high school
I only weighed fifty six pounds

all I could do was to not be there in my head

_________________________
Some Things are not problems to be solved, rather, they are facts which must be coped with over time.

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#168411 - 07/22/07 12:36 PM Re: were we helpless? [Re: FormerTexan]
Logan Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 04/05/03
Posts: 1205
Loc: NY
Sorry but I did not read anyones post but am just answering the questoln for myself.

1st. it seemed like the lesser of two evils, compared to going home. I was only 7 at the time and needed afection soooo badly I thought it was a good source
2nd. When I tried to tell my mom in the first year (itfinnaly end at 9 when nabor mover away," I tried to tell hers TWICE and she did not belive me.
3rd. As it progressed, I though It was partly myfault which he said, caused "you wanted to do it too," and I beliveide it cause I really did participate(but NOT want it!!!!) in it too by that time I was too ashmed af my actions to allow ANYone to know.
Also, I acted out at school, al I did was play doctor in2nd grad with this other kid. I said "I will show you mine , if you will show me yours," thats it. I hear even non-abused boys did that all the time, that it is natural to becurius at that age. So the kid told his mom, who inturn called the shcool. The shcool then called the cops and had them take me out of my classroom and took me to the principles office and and yelled and berrated me ---I truly think this incedent did the most damage to me my entire life----I was in 2nd grade forgodsake, 7yrs old!! So, do you rthink I would EVER tell the school anything ever again???

4th. When I was abused by 2nd perp from 12-14, I thought I was the perp, I was corrupted and bad inside and therefore in some wierd way deserving of it. By that time I hated myself so much I didn't care what happend to me, I just tried to make it as painless as possible.

So finnally 5. Was I helpless? The firstime around, absolutley, although its funny cause in5th grade they talked about "good touch/ bad touch." But, by then I was 10yrs old and there was noway in hell I was going to let anyone in on the secret or btrust the very people that shamed me the first time-FK them. all of my T's hvsaid that the school could NOT have hadled it in a worse way, but I only find this out now? It would have been nice to know that a long time ago!!!!

What I have come to terms with is that, are there resources available to a child at tha tage?-now we know ofcourse there are. but back them, was I AWARE of any recources available to me/-No Fking way, or could I have trusted them? I obviously did not. cause I would have told my teachers, by then the true dammage was already done and I was convined I had played a major role in it all. That I caused it all.

I think this attitude allowed me to be so vunerable to my later abuse. In a sence it allowed me to be revictomised.

This is making me angry and I don't wanna talk about this anymore!!!!!!

-Logan

_________________________
"Terrible thing to live in Fear"-Shawshank Redemption
WOR Alumnus Hope Springs 2009
"Quite a thing to live in fear, this is what is means to be a slave"
-Blade Runner

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#168441 - 07/22/07 05:43 PM Re: were we helpless? [Re: Logan]
KeithR Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 10/28/06
Posts: 363
Loc: Georgia
Jarrad,

I wasn't helpless. But I was vunerable. I was gullable. I did look up to and love my abuser. Unlike some who are abused, I did have people to turn to, but by then, I was too ashamed. I was ashamed that I would be blamed. Each child is a bit different, but every young boy I see who is the age I was when I was abused is vunerable and is gullable. I know they aren't helpless, but I know you don't have to be helpless to be abused. I'm glad the children today are better armed than I was.

I know you weren't helpless, by a long ways, Jarrad, or you never would have made through all that you have. I know you did what you felt you needed to for survival. I don't think you have a character flaw.

I just think some kids just have been given all the weapons to go to war with perps, others haven't. You can't go out and get those weapons as a child, someone has to give them to you.

Keith


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#168443 - 07/22/07 05:49 PM Re: were we helpless? [Re: KeithR]
Hauser Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 11/12/05
Posts: 2962
Loc: United States
I've not read any of the posts on this thread yet, but I thought I might simply reply to your first post Jarad.

I was groomed/manipulated/molested over the course of an entire summer by an older man, and towards the end of it, it was ME who stopped it. I didn't stop it by telling on him, I was too ashamed to do it at the time, but I simply decided that doing sexual things with him were too gross to put up with in return for his attention and affections and gifts. So, no, I wasn't entirely helpless, but the damage was already done.


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