Newest Members
ShinTensei, jaklumen, Bennett, 0128, jeremywickers
12505 Registered Users
Today's Birthdays
Drea (31), gpdno (47), serb guy (49), Thomas8221 (60), UncleClover (43)
Who's Online
1 registered (BraveFalcon), 17 Guests and 4 Spiders online.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Forum Stats
12505 Members
74 Forums
64196 Topics
447992 Posts

Max Online: 418 @ 07/02/12 07:29 AM
Twitter
Page 2 of 4 < 1 2 3 4 >
Topic Options
#140582 - 02/07/07 09:29 AM Re: Catholic perspectives on CSA [Re: Mark Antony]
froggy12 Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 11/12/06
Posts: 527
Loc: Marlboro, MA 01752
I've been to the desert and back, several times.

Hmm. A reverse Augustine: not now Lord, not now.

We can not use today's mentality to understand 50 years ago.

'Faith without good works is a dead faith.' So I do good works without complaint, it is my faith that I wonder about. Yet if God is ( I am who am ) - my wondering is understood, so I don't really worry a lot. Ainsi-soit-il.

ribbit

_________________________
??

Top
#140585 - 02/07/07 10:31 AM Re: Catholic perspectives on CSA [Re: froggy12]
Nobbynobs Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 06/26/05
Posts: 1286
Loc: Toronto
Originally Posted By: froggy12
I don't really worry a lot. Ainsi-soit-il.

ribbit


Let it be.

That's kind of my feeling on the whole thing as well. However, sometimes I just feel a need to ask questions.

_________________________
When you go up to the bell, ring it! Or don't go up to the bell.

- Mel Brooks

Top
#140645 - 02/07/07 06:56 PM Re: Catholic perspectives on CSA [Re: Mark Antony]
Halibut Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 08/29/06
Posts: 228
Loc: Alaska
Hi Nobby,

I'm a Catholic priest, don't have all the answers, but let me offer you some ideas.

CSA ia like any evil thing people do to one another, it is a moral evil for the perp, not so for the victim. It is a violation of the victim.

I was abused by a religious and it is the Church's responsibility to take care of those victimized by those it placed in leadership positions, even if it did so unknowingly put kids in harms way. I'ts also the Church's responsibility to acknowledge what has happened in the past and to prevent it in the future.

For me my spirituality has been my salvation-without it I don't where I'd be. I had a great prayer-experience of God's acceptance of me (I was feeling guilty about being abused) and my prayer life gives me strength to keep going and face honestly the at times painful realities of my life. In the long run I guess being a victim has helped me as a priest to seek integrity since my abuser wore the mantle of religious leadership and used it to abuse me and others.

Where is God in this? I'd love to take it all away, but to use what may be a trite saying to some, "I asked God to take away my burden. He didn't. God strengthened my shoulders to carry it".

Hope this helps w/ your answer. Hal


Top
#140713 - 02/08/07 02:39 AM Re: Catholic perspectives on CSA [Re: Halibut]
froggy12 Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 11/12/06
Posts: 527
Loc: Marlboro, MA 01752
Yeah, I got hit in the seminary as well. Not a nice experience. It depended on the Rector's view of the individual. If you were 'manly' you couldn't have been the perp. Guess what Rev., fucked over twice and perps, my peers laughed the whole time.
So much for Teresian spirituality...too far up the Ascent of Mt Carmel and lost in the clouds.

Then on the outside was coming home from friend's house - was followed, knocked out and woke with a dick in my mouth. I began to ask God if he/she/it had something against me? Nothing personal was the reply. Suffice to say I can be a bit cynical.
So all I can say is "show me the way God; don't let me trip too often." (Thanks Merton)

froggy

_________________________
??

Top
#140742 - 02/08/07 12:37 PM Re: Catholic perspectives on CSA [Re: froggy12]
Nobbynobs Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 06/26/05
Posts: 1286
Loc: Toronto
Guys, could we not make this a clergy abuse thread? I am trying to work through my entry into the Church and I don't really want this thread to descend into a discussion of abuse by priests.

Thanks

_________________________
When you go up to the bell, ring it! Or don't go up to the bell.

- Mel Brooks

Top
#140758 - 02/08/07 03:25 PM Re: Catholic perspectives on CSA [Re: Nobbynobs]
philobat Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 01/31/07
Posts: 293
Loc: California
Hey Nobby-

Unfortunately the Catholics brought this on themselves. It is not a very good topic to post here because of all the abuse that has happened and they way it has been covered up and glossed over. How the Church HAS protected pedophile priests and only until recently have they begun to make financial amends to victims of these horrible crimes.

Posting any topic about Catholicism is likely to illicit similar responses.

While I was lucky to not have been abused by priests, far more survivors have not been so lucky and I support their responses and so should you.

I wish you the best in your endeavor for your paper on this topic, just remember- you asked for responses!



Edited by philobat (02/08/07 03:27 PM)

Top
#140766 - 02/08/07 03:44 PM Re: Catholic perspectives on CSA [Re: philobat]
Halibut Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 08/29/06
Posts: 228
Loc: Alaska
Hi Nobby,

Didn't mean to turn this into a clergy abuse thing, was just trying to express how my experience of spirituality and God has been my help and strength.

Hope your reasearch goes well.
Hal


Top
#140772 - 02/08/07 04:18 PM Re: Catholic perspectives on CSA [Re: philobat]
Nobbynobs Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 06/26/05
Posts: 1286
Loc: Toronto
Originally Posted By: philobat
ey Nobby-

Unfortunately the Catholics brought this on themselves. It is not a very good topic to post here because of all the abuse that has happened and they way it has been covered up and glossed over. How the Church HAS protected pedophile priests and only until recently have they begun to make financial amends to victims of these horrible crimes.

Posting any topic about Catholicism is likely to illicit similar responses.

While I was lucky to not have been abused by priests, far more survivors have not been so lucky and I support their responses and so should you.

I wish you the best in your endeavor for your paper on this topic, just remember- you asked for responses!


I can't believe what I am reading.

I wanted to have a discussion about something that was troubling me as a Catholic. I did not request a discussion on abuse by priests, and my request to end that discussion was because I wanted to return to my original theme.

What do you mean by "Posting any topic about Catholicism is likely to illicit (sic) similar responses?" Are you saying that according to you, Catholics are not welcome to discuss their faith at Malesurvivor without talking about sexual abuse by priests?

How dare you accuse me of not supporting survivors of clergy abuse? I made a request to have the thread returned to my original topic because the abuse by priests topic was not helping me with my problem. This was not a support thread. It was a discussion of a theological issue.

You are new, so I am going to give you the benefit of the doubt and I am not going to formally complain to the moderator about your response. However, if you want to continue to participate in this, or any of the other spirituality threads, I suggest you stop with the attacks on other faiths. With your one post, you have established a very hostile environment for Catholic survivors who might want to discuss their faith on this forum.











Edited by Nobbynobs (02/08/07 05:19 PM)
_________________________
When you go up to the bell, ring it! Or don't go up to the bell.

- Mel Brooks

Top
#141040 - 02/10/07 06:12 PM Re: Catholic perspectives on CSA [Re: Nobbynobs]
philobat Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 01/31/07
Posts: 293
Loc: California
Nobby- I did not ever intend and nor did I read into my response that Catholics are not welcome. I did not single out any particular faith, religion or spiritual belief system as being unworthy or un-welcome in any way whatsoever.

I find it quite clear in my response to your thread that many survivors have had very bad and abusive experiences with religion and with all that is coming out about the catholic priests, the church and its clergy to expect elicit responses directly related to each survivors experiences.

You had asked that the thread not be considered as a venue for survivors venting their abuse experiences as it was not your intent when you posted it.

However, I have found that each of us has a voice directly related to our own experiences and how we may respond to a post regardless of its original intent, cannot be controlled.

I have read many of your posts and spoken to others on here that feel you constantly talk down to them in a very condescending way and appear to be very controlling in your posts and responses and then you suddenly are shocked, appalled and make threats when you are called on it.

Please feel free to turn me in to a moderator. I do not think upon reading my responses that a moderator will see that I have in any way attempted to exclude you or your beliefs from anything.

And for the record, many of the responses to your thread DID INFACT, illicit and trigger responses from more than me.

And it doesn't take someone new to see that.

And if a moderator finds me to be inappropriate- all he/she need do is delete my account. It would NOT be the first time I was forced to shut up and not have a voice!

I do wish you well. We are a sensitive bunch and have every right to be.

And don't say how dare I as if this is something new. You have been at this a while.

Love,

Philobat

And btw, thanks a lot for laying the whole hostile environment for catholics on me and my one post!



Edited by philobat (02/10/07 06:21 PM)

Top
#141049 - 02/10/07 07:39 PM Re: Catholic perspectives on CSA [Re: philobat]
Nobbynobs Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 06/26/05
Posts: 1286
Loc: Toronto
I'm sorry if I have offended you. In the future I will try to take your sensitivities into account when I begin discussions about my faith.

_________________________
When you go up to the bell, ring it! Or don't go up to the bell.

- Mel Brooks

Top
Page 2 of 4 < 1 2 3 4 >


Moderator:  ModTeam 

I agree that my access and use of the MaleSurvivor discussion forums and chat room is subject to the terms of this Agreement. AND the sole discretion of MaleSurvivor.
I agree that my use of MaleSurvivor resources are AT-WILL, and that my posting privileges may be terminated at any time, and for any reason by MaleSurvivor.