Newest Members
MG5555, ShinTensei, jaklumen, Bennett, 0128
12506 Registered Users
Today's Birthdays
Moriji (44), Nicos (48), weharry1959 (55)
Who's Online
2 registered (manipulated, traveler), 18 Guests and 4 Spiders online.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Forum Stats
12506 Members
74 Forums
64205 Topics
448046 Posts

Max Online: 418 @ 07/02/12 07:29 AM
Twitter
Page 4 of 4 < 1 2 3 4
Topic Options
#11596 - 10/15/02 08:06 PM Re: colliding views
Cement Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 06/05/02
Posts: 740
Loc: Southern California
ok, let me try this..

Wuame - your post today helped me at a difficult moment.

Roy - I want to believe that what works for you will work for me, I am just not quite there yet. Philosophically and intellectually, I feel there has to be a release of sexual energy; it's a guy thing, biological, instinctual, right? I don't know if I am comfortable sorting out the consequences yet. I am still re-learning my sexual behaviors. But man, is it hard to resist a simple, naked girl picture right now.

JM - I have to argue that the sex industry is not always or exclusively exploitative of women. This doesn't excuse the use of sexual images for the purpose of masturbation, but maybe it removes some of the guilt associated. Or do I digress?

Lloydy again hits it on the head. The logic of this all doesn't work. There is no zero sum, e.g., "I jerk off, therefore I cannot perform with a partner," or "I have been clean of all pornography, etc. and haven't masturbated so everything is fine." Neither of those is true...yet some portion of both is true.

I cannot say that I understand any of it. Holding off from masturbation and porn gave me one of the best, most intimate lovemaking sessions I have ever had with my wife. I must also say that, now, just a few days later, I am experiencing a strong desire to women in general, and I cannot distinguish the feelings of horniness, guilt, shame and instinct, and that bothers. me.

I have guilt about this, and the guilt hurts. but without the guilt, might I act out? So the guilt is serving a purpose?

My head is swimming with this, because, rather than to apply logic (another trait we share, the desire to make things work logically, is it our attempt to find pattern in the chaos?), I am trying to blurt out what I am feeling, raw and generally unedited.

_________________________
And let the darkness fear our light.

Top
#11597 - 10/15/02 08:21 PM Re: colliding views
Cement Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 06/05/02
Posts: 740
Loc: Southern California
Ah, sex and acting out as a drug and its attendant adrenaline rush. I know it well, as we all do. Someone posted about how it numbs the other stresses and pain away.

I have felt that way, too.

At least the surge and retreat of the pain, shame and guilt of acting out was predictable, like the tide. It had a rhythm, it ebbed and flowed, and I knew that rhythm. I could hold my breath at high tide and wait. The waves would recede, and the softening crash would reveal the beach, hard-packed and smooth, new again.

Now I feel like I am standing in the middle of traffic, angry horns bleating all around me, and I can't concentrate enough to know which way to go.

_________________________
And let the darkness fear our light.

Top
#11598 - 10/15/02 11:40 PM Re: colliding views
New to this Offline
Member

Registered: 09/16/02
Posts: 138
Loc: Mississippi
Cement,

Your own words:
Quote:
I cannot say that I understand any of it. Holding off from masturbation and porn gave me one of the best, most intimate lovemaking sessions I have ever had with my wife.
Your own abuse:
Quote:
Now I feel like I am standing in the middle of traffic, angry horns bleating all around me, and I can't concentrate enough to know which way to go.
Even when we know where we want to be, our abuse takes us back to where we were.

You are on the right path. Don't get lost now.

Devon

_________________________
"Knowledge itself is power" Francis Bacon

Top
#11599 - 10/16/02 12:37 PM Re: colliding views
Wuamei Offline
Member

Registered: 08/19/02
Posts: 2700
Loc: The left turn I should have ta...
JM wrote: "Sexual abuse by my brother(s) and mother preempted any choices of what to do with the tension. When the abuse stopped, the tension got bottled up."

Damn! Another man incested by his mother! I hurt with you, man. Yeah, it bottled up a lot of tension in me too. I'm finally, slowly but surely, learning how to release it properly in healthy intimacy & sexuality, as well as in, as someone said earlier, "finding better things to do with my hands," like typing this!

Take care JM

Wuame

_________________________
"I can't stand pain. It hurts me."
--Daffy Duck

Top
#11600 - 10/16/02 01:20 PM Re: colliding views
Lloydy Offline
Administrator Emeritus
MaleSurvivor
Registered: 04/17/02
Posts: 7071
Loc: England Shropshire
The adreniline rush I could create was huge and could last for a few hours. At it's height it was better than cocaine. I ruled my world and became invincible.
I've multiple rolled a 4x4 down a mountainside more than once, and that doesn't come anywhere near the rush, which is a bit odd because a big part of my acting out was the danger element.
I've acted out in the most public places imaginable, and that was a part of the rush.

The increased heart-rate before the acting out and the high were everything to me.
And even now when I know I'm driving in a dangerous situation I cant get that level. Maybe it's because the 4x4 is a specially built machine with a steel cage and full racing harness etc so I know I wont get hurt. I know that failure just means lost points and some stick from the other guys. At worst it's a bit of mechanical damage and a stiff neck !

Getting caught acting out was the biggest risk I ever took, I stood to lose everything - my wife, family and friends. Probably my home and job as well. How much risk did I need ? Lot's of it apparently, because the rush was addictive and I didn't have the tools in place to stop it and deal with the root cause.
Now, although I remember that level of high I don't need or want it anymore. I recognize it for what it was - sheer terror !

But also I wonder if perhaps I'm missing this association of excitement and sex in some way, has sex become boring ?
Is it something as simple as trying to get some different, and acceptable, excitement back into our sex life ? Perhaps I should suggest a moment of unbridled passion in the back of the car the next time we're on the supermarket car park \:D

Or is that illegal ??

Lloydy

_________________________
Go confidently in the direction of your dreams! Live the life you've imagined. As you simplify your life, the laws of the universe will be simpler.
Henry David Thoreau

Top
#11601 - 10/17/02 02:33 AM Re: colliding views
Don-NY Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 08/06/02
Posts: 546
Loc: Long Island, NY
Here's another perspective. Make of it what you will. It makes me angry and sad.

I stopped all acting out that involved other people 16 years ago. I just finally knew that it was destructive. I didn't fully understand why, but I knew.

That was also the end of my sex life as most people would define such. So, if it wasn't for fantasy and masturbation, I would have no sexual activity or release at all, if you can call it that.

Does it ever get out of control? Have I been up until 4 am, when work started at 6, cruising the net, and doing my thing for 6 or 8 or 10 hours?

Yes.

Will that happen again?
Maybe.

Am I a sex addict?
Doubtless.

Do I sexualize everything?
I did. More so the younger I was. But I don't take credit or blame for that. I put it right on the perpetrator who started that train running when I was three. Over all, I've gotten better in this area. Maybe it's middle age.

Do I think some things are off limits?
Well, maybe not in thought. Unless I think it should be for some reason. The limit is in the boundary. I don't have a partner, but I don't think I would share every single thought, sexual or otherwise, that might cross my mind if I did. On the other hand, I have a friend who I can, would, and have told some pretty PERSONAL FANTASY material to. In context, it just made us closer friends. Maybe not the same, because we don't and never have had a physical relationship, but my point is, I knew that talking about it would not be damaging with this person.

Nature?
Hell yes. Hormones and instincts. If I don't "take care of business" for too long, it becomes very, very obvious, and yes, necessary.

Now to Lloydy, you wrote this:
Quote:
The fantasies are shit, and I can't find - no - I don't want new ones
I just think that is the wrong idea. I think it is wiser to replace them with better ones, however you wish to define better. I mean, short of brain dysfunction, we will always have fantasies, dreams, imaginings. I think they can be re-programmed, just as was discussed in the affirmations thread. And the ones that can't be gotten rid of, well, we don't have to act on them; we can learn to distract, divert our attention elsewhere. It can be done.

So the sum total of what I'm saying:
Fantasy and masturbation are neutral things. Neither good or bad in and of themselves.

Fantasies will happen. Observe them for what they tell you about yourself and thought processes. They may be the legacy of SA, or they just may be a true desire. Acknowledge them for whatever they are, if you can. And then, either enjoy them or work to change them to ones you do enjoy. Consider carefully before they are shared with partners. Be sure you know why you are sharing them. It's very common for survivors to do or say things like that in order to get just the reaction we later bemoan. It's a passive agressive move that confirms our own self defined defects. Don't fall into that trap.

And masturbation. If it's a problem, out of control, obsessive, well then work on that. You don't worry about exactly where and who gave you a cold, you do what you must to take care of yourself and fight it. Why do any less for something so much more important?

Sorry if any of this comes across as preachy or impatient. I'm feeling weird lately, but I wanted to put my 2 cents in too.

Later,
Donald

_________________________
If you understand everything, some things are just as they are. If you understand nothing, things are still just as they are.

Top
#11602 - 10/17/02 01:02 PM Re: colliding views
Lloydy Offline
Administrator Emeritus
MaleSurvivor
Registered: 04/17/02
Posts: 7071
Loc: England Shropshire
Don
I guess you're right there, now it's pointed out clearly. Thanks for that friend.

I suppose what I don't want to replace my old fantasies with is more of the same.
I don't want fantasies that might take me back.

If I can fantasize over a pretty girl, and erotic scene in a movie or even regular sex porn, I wouldn't be bothered. But I just can't get that to kick in.

It's as though I've thrown the baby out with the bathwater - my old fantasies have gone ( mostly ) and the ability to use any fantasy seems to have gone with them.

I KNOW that logic says to me that fantasy is fantasy, it's what goes on inside my head and can't really hurt me.
If I fantasize about sheep shagging - so what ?
As long as I don't get a job as a shepherd nobody gets hurt.
And masturbating, that's the same - who cares if I crank one off in the shower ?

That's the reality - I know it.

I think I'm frightened that it'll come back, if I just let it get a foot in the door and allow it to give me pleasure will I be back out there cruising the toilets ?

No, I don't honestly believe I would - but I just can't convince myself 100 %
I know what it did to me, and the thought of doing it again terrifies me.

Logically, if I learned to do away with it all, I should be able to learn new stuff. Maybe I'm a slow learner. But I'll try, I promise I will.

Lloydy

_________________________
Go confidently in the direction of your dreams! Live the life you've imagined. As you simplify your life, the laws of the universe will be simpler.
Henry David Thoreau

Top
Page 4 of 4 < 1 2 3 4


Moderator:  ModTeam, TJ jeff 

I agree that my access and use of the MaleSurvivor discussion forums and chat room is subject to the terms of this Agreement. AND the sole discretion of MaleSurvivor.
I agree that my use of MaleSurvivor resources are AT-WILL, and that my posting privileges may be terminated at any time, and for any reason by MaleSurvivor.